Hey it works! Alright, I'll begin laying things out, with slightly better formatting than I usually have. Might take awhile.

Test post please ignore:

The vast majority of your case against me has basically been "no u", but if you want we can rehash it out, step by step, for Chop's benefit.

That might be your answer actually. Compare who in this case is using hyperbole and being relentless and who isn't... If you want me to re-summarize all the points I've made against Orange I can do that; it has gotten muddled in the past two days. Despite what he says, I have not made "multiple logical fallacies". Now that you talk about it and I type this out, Orange is doing exactly what I did to you. He's ignoring post content or the actual content of an argument. If I try and point out that he was the only one to continue arguing for a lynch on Voe and did so with weak arguments against me instead of the actual content of my arguments, he just skips over that. He picks and chooses what he argues against instead of the whole picture.

I mean, he's literally been using multiple logically fallacies. He's not built a solid case. TBH if I lose, it probably is my own damn fault, because I haven't been sitting here pointing out every one. It just feels so blatant I'm just like "how can everyone else not see this?". Like how I keep saying he can't say my points both do and do not have merit.

The reason I was leaning toward iLTS being scum in this game was that I was in those same shoes last game when I knew I was town but iLTS was going after me with whatever bullshit he could find. It seemed to the outside like a really solid case but I knew in my mind that I was town so I kept fighting. Perhaps I have some empathy for you, but that could also be my downfall, so I'm trying to be careful.

I should have linked the video instead of just quoting it yesterday

Like I shouldn't have to explain to you HOW TO THINK. You've been to kindergarten.

Oh look I contradicted myself and people don't think I'm scum. Amazing. I could do this all day!

Nah, that was the starting point. Your arguments are like literally incoherent and continually misrepresent what I say, which is the biggest reason why I've had scummy vibes from you this entire time. Town-ILTS isn't this incompetent.

And you conveniently skip over the fact that KY was in favor of a lynch of you today.

All of your reasonings, from both sides, seem pretty sound. KY's read on Orange, plus some of iLTS' reasoning, gives me pause on my iLTS scum read. So I may have to go back through the thread and hopefully not just WIFOM it but try to read between the lines as far as actions, reactions, and emotions. This game right now:

It was more to point out that what Orange has been saying since last night is just false and a scum tell. I did not start out with attacking him and he opened up with being pretty hostile to me. Orange did have two options D2 for possibly pushing the lynch onto, myself and KY. Once you said you were suspicious of me, I think that made KY the better target for him. He had to go for either of us.

You ignore the fact that KY and I have a long standing buddy-buddy relationship, and if there's anyone I can charisma, it's him, whereas Chop and I are usually at each other's throats.

If I'm scum, why would I actually be worried about KY investigating me when you take in all the facts and information? KY stated he thought Orange was mafia Either Voe or KY are the sane cop, so it's a 50/50 chance KY had only myself or Orange left to investigate Knowing KY's meta, I would think that he would investigate the player he's actually suspicious of. So if I'm mafia why would I eliminate a player who is "on my side"? If I had killed ChopBam that would be the expected night kill and wouldn't put any suspicion on me. Then it'd be down to me and someone who was already leaning my way. A KY kill for me as mafia would just be dumb. That would put me at a less than 50% chance of winning as mafia, which is worse than just gambling on a cop investigation.

Yeah exactly, but that'd be 50/50 on whether the sanity belonged to you or to KY, and another 50/50 on whether KY targeted iLTS or you (because if KY targeted you and got town, he could have been seen as a naive cop). @iLikeToSnipe, do you have possible motivation for Orange to have gone after KY last night? The main thing I can think of is that KY was scum reading Orange yesterday and I was scum reading you, so the trajectory of D2 reads would give Orange a good chance. What say you?

That exchange doesn't stand out to me in either direction any more than it did when I first read it, and I'd say for the same reasons as when I first read it.

Hmmm I guess we'd have to take a step back yeah, but at the same time if I copped him he'd probably just say I'm lying and that's less of a risk than if it was KY.

Hm, actually he still might not know whether the sanity was yours or KY's, but still likely not a risk to take.

That would have been an excellent reason to kill him. I'm trying to find motivation (from iLTS "town perspective") for you to have gone after KY last night. On the flipside, I am finding good motivations (from your "town perspective) for iLTS to have gone after Voe and then KY.

IF KY was the sane cop and copped me there'd still be doubt that he'd be the naive cop and ILTS could have played that off, but what if KY copped ILTS? That'd blow things wide open. Would ILTS take that risk? ILTS would know Voe was insane and thus KY sane so he'd be worried about it.

If Voe was insane and KY sane and KY was gonna cop either me or ILTS that could be why he was killed.

Correct I think, but most unfortunate.

That looks good to me at first glance.

Somebody lemme know if I got anything wrong here. General Player N0 Report N1 Report N2 Report Sane Insane Naive Paranoid Voe iLTS/Town - -         Killing_You Chop/Town Voe/Town -         iLikeToSnipe Voe/Mafia Chop/Mafia Orange/Town         ChopBam KY/Mafia Orange/Mafia Chop/Mafia         OrangeP47 Voe/Town KY/Town iLTS/Town         iLTS Bad Player N0 Report N1 Report N2 Report Sane Insane Naive Paranoid Voe iLTS/Town - -         Killing_You Chop/Town Voe/Town -         ChopBam KY/Mafia Orange/Mafia Chop/Mafia         OrangeP47 Voe/Town KY/Town iLTS/Town         iLikeToSnipe Voe/Mafia Chop/Mafia Orange/Town   Claim     Orange Bad Player N0 Report N1 Report N2 Report Sane Insane Naive Paranoid Voe iLTS/Town - -         Killing_You Chop/Town Voe/Town -         iLikeToSnipe Voe/Mafia Chop/Mafia Orange/Town         ChopBam KY/Mafia Orange/Mafia Chop/Mafia         OrangeP47 Voe/Town KY/Town iLTS/Town     Claim  

Same. Here have some more.

TBH I'm just glad the people who can make the charts didn't die because I'm not good at that. I can't count the number of times I've tabbed back to page 4 to look at the web.

moar charts

I'll start with some charts, gimme a bit.