Jeod
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Posts posted by Jeod
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Let me be clear: I am a Flame Tower.
-I chose to use my gun in an attempt to shoot Mojoman rather than save it for a bigger threat when I knew Mojoman was going to die anyway
-As an Allied Defense, I would have hidden my role for as long as possible since I would shoot Soviet and third party visitors (I didn't)
-I didn't hammer Nodlied when I could have (when I mistakenly thought it would be hammer) to save him since he was a building
-I keep pushing for Nodlied or Cat5 to be shot and leave it to a vote (in laying out my theories, I even list that Nodlied could be a chronosphere)
-By this point later in the same day, I am gravitating towards a Nodlied shot. This is later confirmed when I vote to shoot Nodlied
-I was happy that Killing_You decided to take action before waiting for our deadline
-I am open with what happens if I'm an Allied Defense; I would probably not even mention this if I were scum
If I was a building, I wouldn't oppose being shot, if there was a promise to revive me with an Engineer.
I don't oppose being shot normally. If the chronosphere repair theory is true (and I think it might be based on my POV right here), then there is no time for me to be shot and revived. Even if I wasn't revived, there still wouldn't be time, and if the theory is wrong, it isn't safe for me to be dead.
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Oh my God you can't be serious. Okay, I just woke up. Lemme grab some coffee, and then you clowns are in for it.
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There's also the evidence that we all knew Killing_You was a Sniper. It is a high likelihood that even a newer mafia player like moonsense could read the role list and see that he should take no action.
However, I cannot overlook how quickly Killing_You agreed with my chronosphere repair idea. I'm not suggesting the idea was a bluff to get information, because it wasn't, but there was information nonetheless.
I'm still for the repair plan, btw.
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Chaos:
1. I do plenty of things when I play mafia, including coming up with long analysis posts. I'm going to miss small things like lore from time to time. Cat5 did the same with the chrono tank. If you want me to address it now, I remember that a Red Alert 2 plot recap said that Einstein "used his chronosphere device to travel back in time and forever alter history". I believe that line plays during the installation narration for RA2. If it's incorrect, my bad, but that is how I remember it and thus is how I equate chronosphere to time travel.
2. Buildings cannot physically move, hence building "visits" do not allow anyone to retaliate. Plenty of roles do this.
3. Today's confirmation is a complete 180 because of what happened yesterday and today. Yesterday Nodlied was shot and Cat5 was not a proven building by lynch. I wanted to test my theory that his ridiculous war factory claim was false. The lynch failure confirmed him as town in my analysis.
4. I've gone over quite a few times today why I can't be an Allied base defense.
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So far we have 3 in favor of chronosphere repair and 2 in favor of lynching today (one for Moonsense). Good thing we have time to plan our course of action.
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Eh, just sharing my observations.I think in previous games, when an Allied player was found, there would always be "Allied Propaganda" left in the player's belongings, which would flavor-prove the alingment.
This case was probably different just because the player was a building, not an infantry or vehicle.
Not to mention constant mentions of allies planning stuff in the Night posts and lynching remaining allies in the day ones.
Verti did say it was just his standard rules post somewhere.
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I see. Sorry for being late to the party. Were there ever any Allied buildings in the previous game? Because if Nodlied is just a bulding, and a damaged one at that, this whole game could be a horror/ghost story scenario with the visceroids and damaged chronosphere. Although it would have fit better if Nodlied were a third party. If Vertigo is trying something new, I'd say we definitely have feedback for him at the end of the game.
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May I also remind that there was no "Allied Propaganda" found on Nodlied's death.
So there might be 1 more person who's allied at heart.
Quite a meta argument but so far it was always the case AFAIK.
"Allied Propaganda"? Forgive me, but what do you mean?
If you mean like the Starshina gun found on Mojoman, Nodlied was a building and was not converted.
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You've making it more complicated than it is. Read back on what it said:"Are there more hostiles in the base? We must find out before it's too late!"Clearly, if there weren't hostiles in the base, the game would be over. Our victory conditions would be met. There is a hostile remaining.Also"We must not stop now however. Find and lynch the remaining Allies before it's too late!"
The perils of reading hammer posts while at work. I missed that, as well as the chrono storm. Then again, flavor is flavor and due to the circumstances we face, I won't hold anything back because it might be crazy.
A War Factory that can only make heavy tanks is odd to me, since we have a Barracks that can offer all the Soviet infantry units. But ChopBam cleared you, so I have to accept that oddity.
As I said, if there is a remaining hostile, it must be moonsense unless Killing_You did not nightkill two nights in a row for some reason.
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I'm gonna undo that. I gave it some thought and it has to be either moonsense or a chronosphere repair. Killing_You being scum doesn't explain the lack of night kills. Until that can be explained, I'm much more comfortable with the chronosphere repair than scumhunting for now.
##vote nolynch
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Just a Heavy Tank. That's all I can build.
I'm of the opinion that this plan is crazy. I've seen VERTi60 make a flavor that sounded threatening only for it to suddenly go away once town wins. For example, there was a flavor like that a couple games ago when I was turned into the KILLER MINE LAYER. All it required was removing the last hostile player. If I was lynched, the threat would have went away.
I also don't think VERTi60 would have told us about the Engineer role repairing things if we actually were supposed to figure that out on our own.
Well, using the engineer to repair hostile buildings is unprecedented right?
Cat5, you think it's crazy. The alternative is either Moonsense or Killing_You is the last hostile. If you don't think the chronosphere repair is the way to go, then who do you think is scum?
##unvote
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Well, they're automated base defenses so there's no precedent on how or if they can get a refill. There's a better option in the vehicles anyway.
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I'll agree with Chaos_Knight with that even with the sniper's 25% stuck and 75% accurary, Nodlied can still be missed and then he kills us again :vWe'd need to have a night-action-blocking the night after shooting Nodlied if the shot fails. I wonder if a HT can help somehow with that? What else can we do?
I'd be willing to bet the chronosphere needs to charge after each use. If his role picks up where it left off, it'll need to charge one night before it can be used again. It's a great point though, but the Sniper is the best we have.
Chaos, the Barracks offers refills as well as class changes right? If so, and if KY has a full Sniper rifle, you could see if I can gain a refill on my Flame Tower shot the night Moonsense is repairing the chronosphere. That'll give us three shots to use the next day as a failsafe.
Although that's completely your call. I'm trying to think of how we can do this while ensuring Nodlied's death. So, alternatively, if KY misses his shot, you could switch him to Shock Trooper while Nodlied is charging up. Then, he has another shot the next day and can paralyze Nodlied the next night.
Mafia Edit: The war factory, that's right! Category5, what units can you produce? Do you know any of their stats and abilities?
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I'm not afraid to die. It's just impossible to do at this stage. If you want to test me for one-time lynchproof then go right ahead.
The alternatives to the Vortex theory is Moonsense or KY being scum. Unless KY is scum and Nodlied's revival benefits him due to nightkill ability, they're both being cooperative. And even if KY is scum and wants Nodlied to return, they can't manipulate the votes even if there was a nightkill tonight. It would be 3v2.
If Moonsense is scum we'll quickly find out, since if the game doesn't end after Nodlied dies (again), we resume the scum hunt with no repercussions.
Also, to reiterate: I have been proven to be a building. If I am scum, I cannot make nightkills. Therefore, when Nodlied dies and we resume the scumhunt, I'm found quickly. If Moonsense and KY are both lynched, there's still Cat5 and Chaos, two clears. I would not be able to win no matter what.
There is no way I'm scum, and even if you don't trust me, there is no reason to ignore the possibility that the vortex is the last enemy.
Mafia edit: We don't know if the chronosphere is capturable or not. It could be a safe bet that it is, since that's what we would use to stop the vortex if anything, assuming that simply reviving Nodlied doesn't work. The vortex was definitely caused by Nodlied's death, since chronoshifting ChopBam would have caused the vortex on the same day.
A scum player wouldn't want to bring Nodlied back and risk the chance he can be captured.
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KY, the whole reason for repairing the chronosphere is to see if it gets rid of the Vortex. I can't think of any other way to beat it, and it's less likely that there's a scum left. When Nodlied comes back, he must be shot immediately regardless of if it stops the Vortex.
That's what I meant. If repairing and shooting the Chronosphere gets rid of the vortex, but the game is still going, that is the grounds for resuming a scumhunt. Until then, I'll be acting under the assumption that this is what we need to do.
We're on the same page at least. There is absolutely no risk on reviving Nodlied unless we take the extra steps required to shoot and revive me.
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I guess we don't have time to try lynching Nodlied first before shooting him, as then he could do a nightkill, right?
Right.
Chaos, you would have to give two refills. One to Moon for another wrench, and one to KY for another gunshot. There is no time for that.
I'm about to get ready for my shift today, so I'll vote the nolynch.
##vote nolynch
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I don't feel comfortable taking the shot if this engie plan has a chance to work. I say we do the repair the chronosphere plan, and only if that doesn't result in a game-over do we take out scum.
Also, Chaos, the golden wrench is one-time use. You need an extra night for refilling moonsense.
Correct. We don't have time to test it on me. I've already given several reasons I can't be scum, as has Cat5. I'm 99% sure this is what needs to be done.
KY, the whole reason for repairing the chronosphere is to see if it gets rid of the Vortex. I can't think of any other way to beat it, and it's less likely that there's a scum left. When Nodlied comes back, he must be shot immediately regardless of if it stops the Vortex.
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Now now now.
Since we indeed have an engineer role which can bring back structures, why not reveal who Jeod really is to clear up the confusion?
KY can snipe him, and if he's really FT, we can proceed with the suggested plan with one extra step of me giving an training ticket for someone to first bring Jeod back and then try and repair Nodlied.
After all, it seems that we have time.
Unfortunately that won't work. ChopBam never actually died. He was chronoshifted away. The Vortex will use two spaces, Isaac and Mojoman, to arrive. Two spaces is what we need to execute this plan. If we shoot me first, then we need an extra few steps to refill for KY and Moonsense. By then, the Vortex will be here.
Also, Nodlied will not have time to react once brought back. He will not have a night phase. If you look at who will be alive:
Cat5
Killing_You
Chaos_Knight
Moonsense
Jeod
Nodlied
There is no way for scum to manipulate votes even if Nodlied is brought back. And since KY must shoot Nodlied the day he is brought back, he will be lynched if he does not, which means Moonsense will be left to become a Sniper during the night and shoot Nodlied the next day. However, that will give Nodlied a night phase to act.
We must be absolutely sure that KY is town if we go through with this.
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Verti, since we're at a low player count, can we move to 24 hour days after today?
I guess there's no need since we can always hammer nolynch. I was concerned there would be too much wait time if we went with this plan.
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That's what he's saying. And we can hammer it. I'm not voting until there's more input.
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Sounds good to me, although I can only track every other night. Not that it matters, anyway.
So you cannot track Moonsense tonight to be sure that he chooses Engineer? If that's the case, you'll need to track him on step 6. If he's scum and doesn't choose Engineer, then we can shoot him or lynch him if he makes a nightkill.
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If we go through with this plan:
1) Chaos Knight offers Moonsense a package tonight
2) Moonsense becomes an Engineer
3) Killing You tracks Moonsense to make sure he is an Engineer (I assume the Sniper would know if Moonsense takes an action to become a role)
4) The next day, depending on Chrono Vortex events, we lynch a building player again
5) Moonsense uses Engineer power to revive Nodlied
6) Killing You does not need to track Moonsense unless he was not able to see if Moonsense chose the Engineer class (i.e. was only shown that Moonsense was choosing a class, but not shown which class it was)
7) The next day, Killing You shoots Nodlied
???9) Profit!
1) Chaos Knight offers Moonsense a package tonight [Vortex reaches Isaac's grave]
2) Moonsense becomes an Engineer
3) Killing You tracks Moonsense to make sure he is an Engineer (I assume the Sniper would know if Moonsense takes an action to become a role)
4) The next day, depending on Chrono Vortex events, we lynch a building player again
5) Moonsense uses Engineer power to revive Nodlied [Vortex reaches Mojoman's grave]
6) Killing You does not need to track Moonsense unless he was not able to see if Moonsense chose the Engineer class (i.e. was only shown that Moonsense was choosing a class, but not shown which class it was)
7) The next day, Killing You shoots Nodlied
8. ???
9) Profit!
Edited for Vortex movements.
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I'm starting to think that's what needs to happen. As a matter of fact, here's what I think has been going on this whole time:
-Nodlied was the only scum.
-Nodlied couldn't chronoshift anyone while visceroids were in play.
-Nodlied started damaged, and would win if a Chrono Vortex was created and not stopped.
-Town goal is to fix the Chronosphere and kill/lynch it the next day.
Thus our plan is to have Wallymoon become an Engineer (as I am already a sniper), have him golden wrench Nodlied, and then I shoot him. If I miss, we lynch to be sure. If lynch fails, I reload and shoot again. And thus...
##vote nolynch
Can't nolynch due to penalty. Vote Chaos Knight, Category5, or me.
##unvote
Anyone else have thoughts on this?
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I'm heavy considering the possibility that fully repairing the Chronosphere (thus bringing it from 'damaged' to 'fully operational') is our winning ticket. There hasn't been another nightkill. We can be 95% sure that the Chrono Vortex spawned because Nodlied was a damaged chronosphere that was shot (and he might have been lynchable). An Engineer repairing him during the night phase would almost certainly bring him back to full health, and Nodlied wouldn't be able to do anything until the next night. We would have one day where we could shoot him to finish him off, regardless of whether he becomes fully repaired.
I want some thoughts on this. Does it sound feasible? If we lynch either KY or Moonsense, we lose our opportunity to test this, since one of them needs to be an Engineer and the other a Sniper to guarantee a good shot.
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[Complete] RA:APB-themed Mafia game III
in Forum Games
Posted
YOU NEED TO PUT YOURSELF IN MY SHOES AND SEE WHY I'M ONLY FOR THE CRAZY CHRONOSPHERE THEORY BECAUSE I KNOW I'M TOWN.
Chaos is fucking ignorant on anything I'm saying because he's dead set on me being scum. He won't have it any other way. That's not how a clear should think.