ts Dev.Blog 6- Peace through Pinecones (12/6/2011)

[Guest r315r4z0r]

What do you mean? Why would the MKII squish a building?

[Guest ryknow]

Cause he's suggesting changing structures into vehicles so they may be cloaked, but raising the squish value so that the Mammoth's ability to squish vehicles doesn't cause it to 'squish' a building.

 

If that's possible, I'd really like that in.

[Guest r315r4z0r]

Since when can the MKII squish vehicles?

[Guest ryknow]

Since when can the MKII squish vehicles?

Since wally mentioned it

I'm guessing it's allowed to since in cut-scenes it squishes some, and in Reborn, it's size makes it hard to aim at its feet, so if Nod dumb enough, it can squish em.

Prevents them from parking in his blind spot and slowing him down.

[Wallywood]

This was an Idea that we were thinking about to prevent leg ramming. Nothing set in stone about this.

[Guest r315r4z0r]

But isn't the MKII like a rock? Why would anyone CHOOSE to leg ram it? It would be like running yourself into a wall. The MKII should be able to push through any vehicle that is trying to prevent it from moving and it should not react to the infulence of any vehicle ramming into it.

 

The only vehicles that should effect the MKII's movement are deployed vehicles which shouldn't be able to be pushed.

[Wallywood]

Because this community loves finding exploits to give them the advantage and they will not think twice before using these exploits to get an advantage. I have seen this many times before and my goal is to prevent any game breaking bugs like this from hitting the public servers.

[Guest Retaliation]

Besides had the thought of making a tank crushing unit occurred to westwood before YR I'm sure the first unit they would have wanted to add that too would have been the mammoth MKII. It just fits so well.

[Guest APB_ICE]

Just because it's awesome:

 

Off-topic: Will the Obelisk have an awesome destruction animation? :emot-dance:

Edited December 11, 2011 by APB_ICE

[Guest r315r4z0r]

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against having it crush vehicles... what I'm against is using that mechanic as a cop-out of having to make the MKII a walking megaton of unstopable force. Nudging the MKII should be like nuging the Empire State Building with your bare hands.

 

Also, realize that just because the MKII could crush some vehicles doesn't mean that it will be immune to being pushed around. For example, what if a buggy or some other vehicle hits it from the side? What about aircraft flying into it?

[VERTi60]

I suppose it will have the greatest mass so that none of the vehicles can really do anything to it, at least regarding ramming/pushing.

 

I'm interested for the banshies though. Flying around it and on it like mosquitoes.

[Guest ryknow]

Units that land ON it get crushed right.... be sad to have someone essentially paradrop on it.

[Raptor29aa]

@ ryknow but paradroping + C4 used to be my strategy for killing the MKII

 

@ wallywood As far as leg ramming is concerned it works best with the ore truck on uneven hills/terrain (catching it on threes legs helps immobilize it).

 

@ verti60 The last RC I tested the AI sams on it were beasts not to be ignored.

[Wallywood]

@ ryknow but paradroping + C4 used to be my strategy for killing the MKII

Well no Nod unit is getting C4 now so that is no longer going to be an issue

 

@ wallywood As far as leg ramming is concerned it works best with the ore truck on uneven hills/terrain (catching it on threes legs helps immobilize it).

yeah I remember testing that and succeeding on knocking it other a few times.

 

@ verti60 The last RC I tested the AI sams on it were beasts not to be ignored.

Very very true, they can and will take you down if your not paying attention

[Guest APB_ICE]

Well no Nod unit is getting C4 now so that is no longer going to be an issue

That reminds me...

 

The Cham' Spy is getting decoy remote C4... even though no Nod unit is getting remote C4 or, for that matter, any kind of C4. Wouldn't this basically be useless against any non-newbie player? :confused:

 

IMO, it should be replaced with something more useful.

[Enduar]

Damn, ICE has a point. If no Nod units get C4, then the decoy C4 is pretty much a pointless ruse- Nobody would fall for it, unless the "No Nod C4" bit is going to be revised (Though I'm not particularly sure which unit/units would end up getting C4 at this point).

 

Maybe it could be a decoy superweapon beacon, or perhaps a bug that when attached to the Engineer's hacking point would randomly set off "Building under attack" alerts until disabled?

[Wallywood]

How is it pointless? The remote decoy C4 is there to trigger ""X" building is under attack" string and the fact that NOD has an underground rush ability you'll never know if that is a real a threat or not. So if it does go unchecked it could mean that it is really being attacked. Plus it will be a great way to get GDI troops away from a hacking engie that might be working on another building.

[Enduar]

It was my understanding that Reborn's C4 would function more like APB's than Renegades, making it a much more serious threat. That said the first thing that comes to mind is the panic induced by hearing that subtle beeping noise, not the "building damaged" bit. So I guess it's not useless, just... Not as much of a panic/troll tactic like I thought.

 

Now that I've mentioned it, though, I do rather like the idea of a persistent, random-ish diversion device. Same concept, except rather than "blowing up" (or whatever the decoy mine will do) once, it will stay attached and randomly trigger the warning until it's removed, or a certain amount of time has passed.

Edited December 13, 2011 by Enduar

[Wallywood]

Because of engine limits, a structure must take damage to trigger these strings

[Enduar]

Hm. I guess it's easier to keep it C4-like, I would guess it would complicate things trying to make it deal some negligible point of damage every now and then to achieve the same effect.

 

At any rate, I don't think it's a big deal. Did you guys have any idea yet how many decoys the Chameleon Spy will be allowed to carry?

[Wallywood]

Well I'm thinking he going to have a good amount of them, in case some of them fail to trigger the building trigger. But using them is going to be a bit of a risk because your going to have to get them on the MCT to work and it will unstealth you when you use team and trigger them.

[Guest r315r4z0r]

Can't you spoof the warning? I mean, does it really have to come from the actual building being attacked? Couldn't you just have the "explosion" sound off as EVA's warning? But then again, the problem with that is then you wouldn't technically need to plant it on an enemy structure for it to sound off...

 

However, a problem I see with this decoy thing is that it seems to require too much work to be used and barely pay off in the end. All you really have to do to see that it iis a decoy is check what building is being attacked by pressing K. If you're getting warnings that a structure is being attacked but don't notice any damage being done when you press K, then it's kind of obvious that it's a decoy. With such a flaw like that, it kind of makes the usefulness of the decoy drop dramatically.

 

I think it should be useful in another way.

[Enduar]

Well, since there won't be mines to worry about it shouldn't be too hard. I think it will play out alright, the only structure I could see someone having trouble infiltrating would be the Barracks. War Factories are usually the busiest part of a base, but considering how enormous the GDI War Factory is I don't think the Chameleon Spy will have much of an issue sneaking through. Especially if the Stealth Effect is still that faint, nearly impossible to see shimmering effect I seem to remember.

 

Anyway, I kind of agree with R3. The chameleon spy sounds decent enough for killing people trying to repair the base, and causing some minor (but unfortunately easy to detect) distractions. I'd like to see some additional way to make the class more subversive.

 

Maybe the Chameleon Spy could be used to trick Sensor Arrays, or trigger false alarms? Something like that Nod aircraft did in Tiberium Wars where it causes duplicate signatures to appear on Radar, except it would do the same to subterranean/cloaked unit detection via the MSA. That way the Chameleon Spy could be used to feint the enemy by creating a fake rush, drawing defenders away from a real threat.

 

I'm still not sure how the MSA is going to detect units, or inform the team of it- so this is mostly wishful thinking, but I think it would be a neat idea to see in action.

[Guest Retaliation]

I really really like that idea of a decoy that periodically sets off the base under attack alarm. Allow it to attach anywhere on buildings and you'll force at least GDI player off the field lest they open themselves up to the potential of an attack on that structure later when they get used to the base under attack messages.

[Guest r315r4z0r]

But then again, going along with what I said before, perhaps it is enough... Is this decoy a remote C4? It could actually be used to cause the alarm just before a stank rush or something. But like Wally said, it would be hard sometimes for it to always set off the alarm and sometimes it wouldn't work... especially if someone else set off the alarm for a different structure just a few seconds earlier.

 

Maybe you could circumvent that problem by having the detonation of the decoy send a custom to a script that plays the audio for the attack alarm? And it would only send the custom if it was deployed on an enemy MCT...

 

Can that be done?

[Wallywood]

It will be a remote style C4 and we're going to be basically using the old remote C4 model to do this. I've been told the only way to have it trigger is the building way. But after we test out these plans, we may even add things like having the C4 do infantry damage so you could maybe boobie trap a PT. So there are still some cool ideas floating around with this.

[Guest r315r4z0r]

I think it would work better using GDI's C4 model with a little bit of Nod flare to give it a distinction for those who look at it closely. If Nod doesn't have any units that place C4... then that means any C4 that is placed by Nod is obvious a decoy. But if it looks like a GDI C4, then people might overlook it.

Edited December 13, 2011 by r315r4z0r

[Wallywood]

These C4's may be cloaked anyway. No need to give NOD, GDI weapons.

[Guest indios85]

I think it would work better using GDI's C4 model with a little bit of Nod flare to give it a distinction for those who look at it closely. If Nod doesn't have any units that place C4... then that means any C4 that is placed by Nod is obvious a decoy. But if it looks like a GDI C4, then people might overlook it.

 

having in mind that ghost stalker will be the onlyone carring C4 and it will be only 1 out at the time , i dont belive people will think that is GDI´s C4, specially if you find it in your base.

 

hese charges of C4 may be cloaked anyway. No need to give NOD, GDI weapons.

 

what you mean whit cloaked? it will be completely invisible or it will work like the sbh that if get closer you can see it?

Edited December 13, 2011 by indios85

[Guest APB_ICE]

I like Enduar's idea of making the "decoy C4" a portable signature generator; You place it, and it gives the fake warnings as is already planned, but also generates a few false radar signatures that randomly appear, disappear, move around, etc., to give GDI more of an impression that they're under attack. Even if the GDI team finds out that it's fake, it will still throw them off, and could even be used to mask an actual Nod attack. :ph34r:

 

I also like the idea of using the decoy C4 as a booby trap; It could explode if someone tried to disarm it, and damage nearby infantry, or be remotely activated like a Claymore mine, or something like that. It'd give the Cham' Spy an extra "kick" to make him a real thorn in GDI's side.

Edited December 13, 2011 by APB_ICE