TheIrishman

I don't think I was the person in charge of the depth charges being dropped. It looks like it was a reactionary call from 12 ships, like the USS Beale and the USS Rudolph. At least, that's what I found after a quick google search. Regardless, that's not my second ability. I'm not familiar with that being an argument mostly used by Scum. Do you have any examples? There are two main reasons I think that you could be Scum. First, there's no evidence to support your ability. Second, you've barely done anything so far to help Town. And it feels like you're forgetting my plan to help me prove myself and take down Scum at the same time.

I could easily say the same. It's not proof, it either means Scum is willing to cut ties with Mojo to appear Town, that Jeod is Scum and he's failing to rouse enough support to save Mojo, or that Mojo isn't Scum. Alright, it's late and I'm going to bed, had a crazy shift at work today (understaffed, stuck working with a shitty coworker, and busy af). I'll be back on tomorrow when my brain is fully functioning.

Oh wait, you were just talking about FRAYDO, you didn't track him. But still, claiming to track me after I said I did nothing isn't proof that you're a tracker.

Uh, yeah, you claimed to have tracked a dead man who can't contradict your claims and you claimed to have tracked me after I already said I've done nothing. You're about as bad as Nodlied right now.

I know he said it lowered it by 10 WT, but if I was Scum and I was so worried about it, don't you think I would've blocked him? If I could lie about being American, I could easily lie about my ability being locked. Assuming there's 3 Scum and that Scum can't use an ability and NK, I would've had one Scum member kill Shade while I blocked him. Assuming there's only 2 Scum, I wouldn't have had Mojo use a masonry ability. I would've had him kill Shade while I blocked him. You're thinking about this too simply. If I were not me, but Scum, I'd kill Shade and hold back on any extra WT changing actions to try and pin it on me. And again, you're not even considering other options, like Scum having a WT increasing ability they can only use every other day, or that FRAYDO could've increased it that extra 10 points N1. You're matching things to your own prerogative. If the WT does increase after Scum is lynched, like Jeod thinks, I'll RB whoever you guys think is Scum, even myself if that's possible, and you can have Jeod watch my target. Unless you think it's Jeod, then that'll complicate my proof. And if we have an ability cop like last game, my action is called "Blockade" as in the thing I'm supposed to do Hence the kraken, the nemesis to all ships. It'd be pretty hard for a captain of a submarine to set up a blockade considering he's underwater >.> Given that Mojo is Fidel, there could only be 2 other Scum. If the NK still happens, then you'll know that I didn't do it and that my target didn't either. If the nightkill doesn't happen, then it'd be me and whoever I targeted. Of course Scum could just not NK to get me lynched, but I don't think they'd sacrifice a NK for it. Like I said before, I think ChopBam and Nodlied are our most likely suspects.

You're clearly not paying attention to math or logic then. He said his ability is supposed to stop passive WT increases of one specific Scum player. So, assuming I'm Town, which I'd like to, he wouldn't have done anything if he targeted me. Or, like you said before, if he targeted someone else, or if him dying prevented his ability from activating. So, I gave a few possibilities of why the WT is where it is. Of course, like your ability (which I think almost guarantees you as Town) there could be more players with abilities to affect WT, adding more factors to the equation. It could've gone something like 30 WT + 15 WT - 20 WT, 30 WT + 10 WT + 5 WT - 20 WT, 30 WT + 25 WT - 20 WT- 5 WT - 5 WT, or 30 WT + 15 WT + 10 WT - 20 WT - 10 WT

That's why I said I was hesitant to believe either one of you to be Scum, shifting the focus towards the American Scum until Mojo is dealt with which would help give us a better understanding about you. Where or how did I say that?

I don't know. Let's see, the WT could've only went up by 15 points because FRAYDO was alive N1 and used an ability to affect it. Another option is whatever Scum did N1 to raise it 25 points, they didn't do N2. Or maybe there's were bonus points for killing the Kennedy family.

KY, you need to fix your memory. You first say I'm the last person to reveal my role, then say I revealed it to be American knowing Shade's role existed. Get your timeline straight. I haven't done anything yet. My ability is still locked. I got a message D2 saying that it was unlocked, but it got relocked after FRAYDO died. I'm guessing the WT threshold for it is 35 or 40. I didn't get any notification of Shade's ability hitting me, but I don't have a passive either.

Oh damn, a lot happened while I was away. Mojo I stand corrected, I didn't think you could come up with that cover identity and I guess I was wrong. With Shade dead that puts the most likely Soviet Scum back on KY and Retaliation, but I'm hesitant to believe either to be Scum right now. I'm gonna put the Soviet search on hold until Fidel Castro is dealt with. A minor correction, KY, Retaliation was the last one to put out his nationality. And of course I wouldn't try to let people know who I am, who'd want to make themselves a target? I did the same thing in the last warmonger game and it worked well, at least after Jeod proved my innocence before his death. Also, I had my avatar out there for you guys which I figured would be enough of a hint if you really thought about it. But it seems necessary to say now. My character is Admiral Robert Lee Dennison. And like I said before, my ability is pretty obvious >.> I initially wanted to joke about the cane and FRAYDO, because I hold the "cane" (blockade). For the American Scum suspects, in order. ChopBam - Has been decently helpful throughout the game, but mostly to the beginner, and has been pretty sketchy with his nightly reports. Claimed what looks to be a tracker role, but hasn't given any reports. Nodlied - He's been away for a good portion but has helped when able. His abilities seem to check out, but he's only "confirmed" things that people have already said. Jeod - Been distracted with GW2, but has been noticeably trying to give more effort. He, for sure, is a watcher at least.

Didn't even notice. Like, sometimes I feel like god is specifically trying to fuck with him. And just a reminder guys about my odd shift, I should get done with work at ~10:00 pm EST, so I won't be around until over 5 hours after day starts.

Anybody else noticing a TP trend with FRAYDO? But glad we got Oswald, and glad that I was half-right :b I was actually going to bring up him as possible Scum initially, but the JFK assassination was a year after the Cuban Missile Crisis. Since there's TP, it makes me question how many Scum there actually are. It's almost certainly 2-3, but now I'm leaning towards 2. And death of TP dropped WT by 10 points; Jeod, what did you have to suggest that Scum wouldn't drop WT as well on death? Retaliation, are you able to use both your abilities at once? If so, can you check FRAYDO's abilities? If you can't, then just stick to your cop role. Top Russian suspect is Shade. Top two American suspects are Jeod and ChopBam. Mojoman and Nodlied are still up for consideration. Nodlied, now that you're back home, I hope you can start playing more.

But I'm leaning towards Town with you as long as you're actually a cop.

I'm inclined to believe him for now, although I don't appreciate him lying about his abilities, it wouldn't be the first time Town has done it to try and either catch scum or avoid becoming a target. In fact, Cat 5 does it all the time. Also no one else has counterclaimed cop, and in this game I would expect there to be at least one cop. Retaliation, if I were Scum, I'd try to push the lynch towards you to get rid of the cop and prevent you from investigating me >.> Between FRAYDO and Shade, they're both almost equal as Scum for me, but Shade's behavior wins out. ##vote Shade939

Since Retaliation claims to be an actual cop rather than some weird one time use kind of investigation, I say we give him a night to prove it. Target whoever you're most suspicious of. With Jeod's presence, whether he watches you or not should be enough to guarantee your safety. ##Unvote Jeod, you could be right about the Russian World Leader being scum, but from history I'd doubt it. This all leans my suspicions more towards FRAYDO or Shade then.

I'm not saying he is, but he's one of my prime suspects. Think of it this way. If Retaliation is Scum, FRAYDO probably isn't Scum since Retal is trying to get him lynched. From my top suspects, only Jeod and ChopBam would be left. Since that's the case, there's a good chance one of them is scum. Again, the premise is mostly built on Retal flipping Scum, if he flips Town, I suspect the Scum team might be Shade and FRAYDO. The third member still being in question.

##vote Retaliation I still think our Soviet scum is either Shade or Retaliation, while I find FRAYDO to be one of the top in my list of 3 for American Scum, I find a 50% shot is usually better than only 33%. Also, if Retaliation is Scum, his partner is probably ChopBam considering the redirection he's throwing towards FRAYDO, which both saves him from being lynched and ChopBam from FRAYDO's prodding.

Last time we killed the new player, it was Misa...and she was scum (granted it was Quantum Mafia - Shade, Quantum Mafia is basically a game where everyone's alignment can change at any time depending on the circumstances). If lynching people always raised WT, then we'd need more people with WT lowering abilities to help counter it. I'm assuming we only have 2 World Leaders, one from America (dead), and one from Russia, which would put KY as Khrushchev, further establishing him as Town. Unfortunately, we don't know the effects of Cat5's abilities, so there's no way to prove just how much he could've lowered WT, but it doesn't seem like enough when you add everything together, especially if everybody thinks 15 WT is the usual gain from anybody being lynched. Can you please name a few examples of meta arguments that have backfired? Besides maybe Kam, because that was D1 and we didn't have much to go off. Thinking of successes, you've been rightfully suspected twice as Scum due to your meta playstyle - mostly jokes with little effort. I've yet to play with Cat5 as Scum, but he's been following his Townie meta pretty much every time, which has helped to clear him throughout multiple games. Orange being Scum kind of became meta, in that he became one of the first suspects when it came to looking for Scum, which had been the case for those games. I'm still new-ish, so I don't know all that is meta yet, but meta means most efficient tactic available for a reason. We don't have much else. Obviously meta arguments aren't always true, but they're something for us to work off of and, if nothing else, can help stir the pot which can help bring us more information. >.> Are you trying to be suspicious, claiming to be smart enough to pull off a Canadian cover? No offense, but I just find it unlikely.

Huh, didn't even know there was a page 10 before now, even though my post popped up on it, too busy with LOTR (it's pretty great so far, btw) Lynching scum always lowered WT in the previous warmonger game, there's no reason to believe it wouldn't do the same in this one. I don't think that's the case, probably 2 American scum and 1 Soviet scum, but I can't believe there isn't one Soviet scum. I don't want to suspect Shade, but my focus is mostly being drawn to him and Retaliation over KY. Why am I clearing KY for now? With the logic Retaliation pointed out, if Shade is Town, then he'd have no reason to lie about KY being Town. If Shade flips Scum, then we can question the results of his "confirmation." But I think if Shade is Scum, he'd be the Captain or Political Officer, which would most likely leave us with two American Scum left. Another person who would've been a top suspect is Mojoman because his behavior was starting to remind me of the CYOR II game where he was the Lich King, but he changed his avatar to Thérèse Casgrain, a Canadian feminist that was completely against nuclear weapons. I doubt he could've just come up with that character, although maybe his scum buddies could've, for now he's on the backburner.

I'll believe you for now, but can you talk some more, Jeod? You're one of the more vocal players I know and you help keep things fun. At least the game is more fun to me the more active players are. No, I did not, which could mean he's lying or that Orange just decided to not inform us. Not quite, you didn't play Nodlied's game but in it certain players could have locked abilities, which means the player can't use their abilities until WT reaches a certain level. In some cases you would only be told that the WT needs to be higher and aren't given a specific WT threshold. I was saying that my stuff was unusable and since that's the case, I didn't do anything last night. I'd rather you target Retaliation or KY since they're the main scum suspects right now, but if this will help bring the investigation back on track, go for it.

Coordinated? I'm usually a very active player, you can check any game I've played. I just keep my laptop on all the time, so I hear the, "Yo!" whenever a new post pops up (though video games or reading can prevent that). And if I were scum, why would I put my supposed scum buddy at the forefront of the investigation? As of right now, I suspect KY or Retaliation the most, and if we lynch one and they turn out to be Town, I plan to lynch the other. If we lynch one and they turn out to be Scum, perfect, then we can move on towards wherever the evidence leads us, preferably Jeod, FRAYDO, and ChopBam. If we forego Retaliation and focus on my other "scum buddy" - ChopBam - He's also been towards the top of my list of suspects. I've never played as true scum (I was like half-scum in a Cat5's Quantum Mafia), but I know it's usually frowned upon to throw your teammates under the bus, especially so early in game. They usually only do it when they have to, like KY and OrangeP47's obvious little drama, seen here. from pg. 19-21 I already explained the circumstances leading towards me voting Voe. This wasn't really a normal game when it came to lynching, though. And I don't think Retaliation is trying to get lynched, I just think he's playing that conspicuously as scum if KY isn't. I think it's more likely that the Captain's or Political Officer's passive would be BP (bulletproof), LP (lynchproof), or an on death action considering their circumstances. Vasili convinced them to change their vote as depth charges were being dropped near them, in addition to the submarine's battery dying and them running out of oxygen - in addition to what KY said, using math, and my own assumptions that 15 points is for a World Leaders death only. And are you claiming to be Neutral? No, I already said, I'm an American Naval Officer. If you guys need me to claim, I can, but my ability is pretty obvious from the bio so scum will probably take me out. I'll check back later tonight, but I've been putting off playing a game I just got, LOTR - Shadows of War.

I'd like to hear what you have to support your claims, because I mostly agree with them if I'm excluded from it. Right now Retaliation and KY are looking to be the most likely choices for Scum, while it's still pretty hard to tell between FRAYDO, ChopBam, and Jeod. This...I'm not sure. I mentioned before about your hesitancy and how you could be spending that time make up something. It does push my suspicions to KY more than you though. Historically, Vlad only dealt with gathering intel, which would make sense for your vaguely claimed investigative action against Cat5. Of course, there is a speculated theory of the KGB being behind the JFK assassination, but nothing substantial was ever found.

It wasn't KY being Soviet alone, but rather him instantly trying to redirect attention away from him being Soviet. I do, however, think that we'll find at least one Scum among the Soviets. Meaning, right now we have Killing You, Retaliation, and Shade. Coincidentally enough, both you and KY have sufficient reason to be suspicious.

Only 4 people other than myself have claimed to be American. If you add in the dead, that makes 6, plus me makes 7. 7 Americans and 4 others (assuming Retaliation isn't American) makes sense in a Cuban Missile Crisis game. And it wasn't 4 people claiming to be American that led to my claim, it was that there was only Retaliation and myself left without a claim. If someone had a nationality specific target, they only need to guess between me and him. If it's something harmful, like KY's previous goal, I don't want to get accidentally killed on a 50/50 chance. If I wanted to, as scum, lie about my nationality to appear townie, I would've claimed to be American right away.

Guys, keep in mind I usually work until ~4:00 EST (depends if they have me stay later) Monday-Friday if you're ever waiting on an answer. Except this tomorrow, I'm off, but I work all day Saturday. So FRAYDO, I said that I was opposed to giving a list of potential characters and their roles, assuming it was historically accurate. That list would've included BOTH Town and Scum, but the reason I refrained was because, while it might've helped us decide who was Town or Scum based on their characters, it also would've added a list of characters that Scum could claim to be. Then KY asked for a list of just potential Scum characters which he claimed could help us, and I didn't see how that could hurt us either so I did, especially if we have a cop that can find out peoples' names. With only two people left who haven't exposed their alignments, if there is someone with an alignment oriented goal, it'd be pretty easy to guess so I'll just throw it out there. I'm an American too. If we want to avoid giving the imaginary TP (imaginary, because we don't know if they exist in this game) too much of an advantage in the next warmonger game, like Cat 5 said, we shouldn't be so hasty to line ourselves up as targets. Right now we have ChopBam, Jeod, Nodlied, you, and me as American townies. Chop, Jeod, and you are roughly tied in suspicion. First Chop having that air force general, even though he claims ignorance, and then his quick collaboration with KY, provided KY flips scum. For you and Jeod, you both mostly sat back until called to do so, you being more excusable considering you weren't aware it started. You immediately went on the prowl for scum, but you missed several things like KY asking me to post the Scum suspects and the fact that Nodlied is American (mentioned twice). It's not much, but you're usually pretty observant. With Jeod, I'm probably a bit more suspicious, he's sat back for most of this game and when he was called to action he lashed out instead of providing any actual effort towards the search. Then he just hops on the bandwagon with your inadmissible question when he's been here the whole time and should've also read every post. That all said, I think Retaliation and KY are the two that we should focus on the most for now, considering one is Soviet and the other is unknown and claims to have visited Cat5 on the night of his death. See KY, I'm not the only one with the misunderstanding. Shade, it sounds like you'd be Voe's favorite since he often gets a daykill.