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Getting even closer now...

In all fairness, I never pick the Grenadier because other infantry do what he does way better. Shaking the balance of this unit up with these changes might actually make him worth buying. We should really stop theorycrafting and play a few matches with the changes before dismissing the new nader as a terrible direction. I'm definitely going to give it a go when I get back to my PC. If you compare the Nader to the Disc Thrower, it's not really fair. The Disc Thrower is GDI's cheap anti armour guy, but he's also pretty effective against infantry too. The Nader was pretty shit against tanks in Red Alert considering that both teams had Rocket Soldiers. This wasn't a problem for the Disc Thrower though because GDI had no Rocket Soldiers. So it's not really fair to compare the two units side by side. tl;dr, eager to see what kind of beast the nader has become.

Turret held together by sellotape and hope after an infantry rush. I think it stayed like this for a few minutes cause I was more concerned with keeping actual buildings alive and the soviets had no WF after the initial rushes anyway. More stellar parking!

An engineer costs 500, can demolish building but suck against enemies fighting him. No one seems to complained about them. The grenadier now costs 500, can harass building from a distance (no repair tools like the engineer but his unlimited grenades is a good trade off) and also suck against enemies (he is no longer suitable to fight now). I think he's alright now considering he's an anti-building-only artillery infantry unit. If we want a splash damaging unit at close range, we have flamethrowers and shotguns. I see now that the soviets have a new infantry class with a different role from others. Now all 4 volokov's weapon's role have its own individual infantry class. Who cares if can't fight vehicles or could kill himself at close range, his specialized role is anti-building.

You're going to have to bear with me with me here, but let's look at it like this: Comparison to other infantry roles in APB: Grenadier (old): Small splash low damage only good in really tight spaces hard for new players to really get on to (not such a bad thing, but I've never used a grenadier effectively) Not really worth the money on any map that has a ref larger than 100m2, because other units do what he does better cheap Good against 2-3 infantry (alone) Grenadier (new): Large splash large damage good in medium sized spaces and open ground needs to lead a target well. Useful inside larger building (I.e. ref, wf) more expensive Good for early infantry rushes if used right Still provides a decent challenge for new players (veteran players get this challenge as free DLC). Good against 3-4 infantry (potentially) Kapitan: Good against 1-2 infantry poor at most CQB cheap Large ammo per mag stays after barr death Sergeant: CQB expert Decent at medium range engagements due to slugs good against 1-3 infantry stays after barr death cheap Flamethrower: Medium splash Medium damage more expensive explodes on death fire retardant Good on all maps Good against 3-4 infantry (basically a better old grenadier) So, if that's not enough, let's take some inspiration from real-life: F1 grenade (old grenadier) Can be thrown super far Can be thrown up close no kill radius damage radius small F1 grenade (new grenadier): Can be thrown relatively far (for a handheld grenade) High damage 3 second timer Large radius (still no guaranteed kill radius) F1 grenade IRL (soviet): 3.5-4 second fuze (generally) 30m effective radius, 200m possible damage radius (the latter is a bit extreme for a game not based on simulation) Thrown up to 30-45m out away from the user Overall the new grenadier has more use (imo) and is more believable Impact grenades did not see very wide use until more modern times in our timeline and older models often ended up causing more harm than good (see the T13 Beano) While you may have to limit somethings usefulness in order to get more use out of it in another area, lets see how this plays out. Talk is cheap. We need an effective script that can log kill messages on the server so that we can see how often grenadiers are used and how effective they are. I'm interested in seeing results.

I think it's the price tag we are unsure of. Also obligatory grenadier vs. longbow gif.

Wait a minute..... So we're focusing on this: So for $500 I get a unit that does less damage vs. buildings and vehicles than the $300 RPG trooper, no anti-air capability, but better versus infantry and slightly longer range.with no LOS needed. And just ignoring the rest? There is nothing preventing your grenades from sticking to aircraft. So lets add this all up... He got a "jumping" buff (the gravity effect), a range buff, a splash radius buff, damage falloff removed, sticky logic added, a damage buff against buildings and naval, a HUGE increase in credit yield, and also got a shiny new pistol, and above all else, the poor guy finally got a defined role on the battlefield....yet he sucks more than before? I'm not following... He isn't supposed to be a RPG trooper. That guy also has a role, but it differs from the 'nader.