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Blog 39 (25/07/07)

OWA

By OWA
in Red Alert 2: Apocalypse Rising

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OWA

OWA

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Welcome to this week's AR blog (Take fucking three)

 

<h3>RA2 Vengeance Video</h3>

Here is a video illustrating some cool stuff from RA2 Vengeance. A mod that has been kindly donated to us by THeKGBSpy. Most of this content is over three years old and does not represent the final quality of Apocalypse Rising. There is a fly through the base that I was hiding last week as well as the battle fortress in action with the kirov airship also making another appearance.

 

 

<h3>New Map</h3>

dtrngd, our new mapper has been cooking up something cool for Apocalypse Rising over the past few weeks. Namely a conversion of the 1v1 map, Little Big Lake from Red Alert 2. Below are some WIP shots of the map.

 

arlake.jpg

betterthansandbags.jpg

 

<h3>Complimentary Renders</h3>

Here are a few renders for you.

 

Firstly is a render of the Harrier by Ric. This will hopefully be in the first release.

 

Lastly we have some IFV Forms by me with assets taken from various donated models including RA2 Vengeance.

IFV Gun

IFV Repair

IFV Sniper

(In no particular ordering)

 

<h3>Vehicle Promotions</h3>

To simplify things, I'll let the master mind behind the veterancy script, danpaul88, talk you through this.

 

Ok, One thing I have noticed with the recent tests is that it is VERY easy to get an Elite Apocalypse Tank by using an infantry unit which gets promoted quickly, such as a GI or Conscript, as they get promoted fairly quickly.

 

This brings to mind the following question: Should vehicles have a SEPERATE points requirement for promotion to the infantry driving them? Your infantry veterancy points would still form the basis of the points required for the vehicle promotion, but the actual points required would be different. Example using some random figures...

Soviet Conscript - Veteran at 12 points, Elite at 24.

Soviet Flak Trooper - Veteran at 14 points, Elite at 28.

 

Soviet Rhino Tank - Veteran at 22 points, Elite at 46.

Soviet Apocalypse Tank - Veteran at 30 points, Elite at 70.

danpaul88 is a Conscript with 28 veterancy points. This means his Conscript is Elite. However if he buys a Rhino tank it would only become a Veteran Rhino Tank. If he bought an Apocalypse Tank it would not even be Veteran.

 

OWA is a Flak Trooper with 52 veterancy points. This means his Flak Trooper is Elite. If he buys a Rhino tank it would become an Elite Rhino Tank. However if he bought an Apocalypse Tank it would only become a Veteran Apocalypse Tank.

 

Each unit has a points value, for example an Apocalypse Tank might be worth 40 points.

 

If you are the unit which actually KILLS the unit you get 50% of the points total (In this example, 20 points)

 

When you DAMAGE the unit you get (50% of points total)/(max unit HP + Armour)*damage. So if our example Apocalypse Tank has 100 max health and 100 max armour and you do 50 damage to it, you get 5 points.

 

Repairing a unit is the same as damage, but divided by 4, so repairing that 50 damage you just did will net you 1.25 points.

 

If you killed a unit and nobody else damaged it you should get the total points value of that unit (ie: 40 points in this example, 20 from the kill and 20 from all the damage done)

 

This is how it currently works, some things might still be adjusted (such as the split of points between killer and damagers), and the weighting on repairs etc. However it gives you a good idea of how stuff works.

I feel this is a sensible way to stop people abusing the veterancy system. What are your thoughts on this?

 

<h3>New Staff</h3>

Congratulations to our three new Bluehell Productions Staff Mambers!

 

Eggman891 who has joined us to solve our rigging crisis after the unexpected leaing of Spice and the AWOLness of Urimas. Expect some good things coming from the father of the Lol Tank.

 

dtrngd has joined us to create some maps and help us on that side of things. As you can see above, he is keen to make maps for AR. Also, be sure to check out some of his Renegade maps.

 

Blazea58 has also joined us to do some mapping. His years of experience are welcomed with open arms. To see some of his work, go and check out the C&C Roleplay 2 map for Renegade.

 

<h3>Staff Announcements</h3>

I got new shoes today! Pics later. (I may forget though)

 

cfehunter quit Final Fantasy XI and is now openly challenging anyone and everyone to a game of Warhammer: Dark Crusade

 

Auditions for Operation L.E.G.O are open! Go audition now!

 

Go enter Chronojam's paint contest! (Although Eggman has probably won with his LOL Tank/Fishgirl combo :flashfap: )

 

Nameme99 recently announced the rebirth of the Scud Storm mod for Renegade......

 

Ric is busy texturing the Soviet War Factory, at the speed of light. (The man's mouse is a blur)

 

The Tiberian Dawn Podcast may be out this week. Edited by me :) The bloopers are really funny. Lord_Kane likes saying his own name :D

 

<h3>End</h3>

BYE
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Guest Allie29

Guest Allie29

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Veterancy system sounds good.

 

Since the turrets are independant (at least seeming so to me) of the Battle Fortress, does that mean they are killable? Or if they aren't, wouldn't that mean any hits absorbed by the turrets wouldn't damage the tank, excluding splash? Or will the damage transfer through the turret to the tank? Also, how's the work on running over tanks and walls with the fortress going?

 

Soviet base looked cool, but Allies ftw :< Ya'll are making me wanna play it more each week.

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OWA

OWA

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Veterancy system sounds good.

 

Since the turrets are independant (at least seeming so to me) of the Battle Fortress, does that mean they are killable? Or if they aren't, wouldn't that mean any hits absorbed by the turrets wouldn't damage the tank, excluding splash? Or will the damage transfer through the turret to the tank? Also, how's the work on running over tanks and walls with the fortress going?

 

Soviet base looked cool, but Allies ftw :< Ya'll are making me wanna play it more each week.

 

Damage is all linked to a main health value.

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Guest deadpikle

Guest deadpikle

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Nice blog.

There won't be a grey team in the first release of AR, will there? Then you won't have to texture anything :p

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Guest havoc8r

Guest havoc8r

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One think I'd like to say about the points system is that maybe you shouldn't put 50% of the points value going to whoever kills something. I hate how selfish people can be when it comes to stupid little things like this. It's also one thing that bugs me a lot in APB. I know it stops one kind of point whoring (or at least slows down), but it creates a whole other kind: people who stop shooting when the health gets low cause they want the last shot. Maybe if it wasn't 50% of the points for a kill it would be better, like maybe 25%? I just don't want to be stuck on a team with people like that... And besides, maybe someone showed up just in time to get the last shot. They fired once and get half of the points (more than half if the damage they did in that one shot was enough to earn some points). It doesn't seem like it'd be fair and I have the feeling a lot of selfish people would abuse it or make dumb decisions because of it (like holding off on firing until it's almost out of life, only to realize that they've given the enemy enough time to fully repair it)

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Guest Nightmare24148

Guest Nightmare24148

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First post, all ones above me are fake!

 

Anyways...wow LOLTANK sans rigger...it seems Eggman can do everything. Congrats AR team :D. And that vet system is awesome.

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Guest rako88

Guest rako88

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i like the veterancy system. i hope snipers can't point whore off vehicles and then take their wrath out on infantry though.

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Guest cuddling

Guest cuddling

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Congrats to you Eggman, I knew you'll get in somehow :D Just dont make all the tanks "lol"

 

Nice blog, i'll get back later to watch the video :)

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danpaul88

danpaul88

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Maybe if it wasn't 50% of the points for a kill it would be better, like maybe 25%?

 

I did suggest that myself in the internal section, something like an 80/20 split, with the 20% for the final kill. The first incarnation of the veterancy system only gave points to the killer, so be glad damage is counted at all :p Anyway, this is why we post stuff in the blARg, so you can comment on it :D

 

 

i like the veterancy system. i hope snipers can't point whore off vehicles and then take their wrath out on infantry though.

 

Snipers won't be able to do much (if any) damage to vehicles, and therefore won't get any veterancy points for shooting at them.

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Guest cmatt42

Guest cmatt42

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I think the veteran system should be completely separate; the prospect of getting 'better' with a tank as an infantry not in a tank is pretty silly. Though I would be satisfied with the proposed system, perhaps you could look into something like this:

 

Say I am a Flak Trooper with 30 points (based on danpaul88's hypothetical system), making it an Elite Flak Trooper. Now the difference with this is, you have a separate points for infantry and vehicles, so if I was a Flak Trooper and never entered a vehicle, I would have 0 vehicle veterancy points and 30 infantry veterancy points.

 

Now, as an Elite Flak Trooper, I'm no newbie to war, but don't necessarily have any experience piloting a vehicle. But, I could probably extrapolate that knowledge from what I know about warfare. Basically, what I say is this:

 

As a basic, non-Veteran infantry, one would have to meet 100% of the requirements to reach Veteran Vehicle status, 100% for Elite Vehicle status. If one was a Veteran infantry, one would only have to meet 90% of the requirements to reach Veteran Vehicle Status, 100% for Elite Vehicle status. Continuing the trend, if one was an Elite Infantry, one would have to meet 75% of the requirements for Veteran Vehicle status, and 90% for Elite Vehicle Status.

 

Even more advanced infantry such as Tanya or Boris could even have less requirement, but not more than like 5%.

 

Anyway, I may seem like I'm rambling because I kind of am, but that's the basic idea. Those numbers I gave were kind of just for example and would certainly need tweaking. Anyway, I could elaborate more if someone wants me to form more coherent thoughts. But, yeah.

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Guest EVA-251

Guest EVA-251

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LOL @ Balls are inert!

 

As for veterancy, I think that you should do it the way it is done in RA2, if possible. That is, you make promotions dependent on the price of the units you kill.

 

In RA2, a unit had to kill an amount of units that totalled up to 3 times its own value.

(VeteranRatio=3.0 ; must destroy this multiple of self-value to become a veteran [per level])

 

This is why Conscripts got promoted easily in combat, as killing 2 GIs would total 400, meaning 1 promotion.

If that is right, lets you say you kill 3 GIs with your Conscript, and are considered an elite Conscript, with $600 in kills. You get in an Apocalpyse Tank, and you still have your $600 in kills, but to get to a veteran Apoc, you would have to kill 1750 x 3 in units/buildings.

 

As for the models, I have no complaints, they all look nice, and is that Kirov bigger? :p

Looking forward to seeing that Harrier skinned.

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cfehunter

cfehunter

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veterancy is going to work like this:

 

You get a veterancy point total from killing/doing damage to things.

 

you get points for doing a percentage of damage to a unit.

 

Each unit is worth diffrent points, say a dog is worth 5 and an apoc is worth 40. Also promoted units will be worth more, a normal apoc is worth 40 and an elite apoc is worth 75. (just an example)

 

each unit needs diffrent points to reach diffrent levels of promotion.

 

I.E:

 

GI Needs 25 points to reach elite

Tanya needs 200 points to reach elite

 

And when you get into a veichle it gets promoted depending on your points, but the same applies for them to, if you're an elite GI you wont be able to get into a prism tank and have it become elite, that would be unfair.

 

 

However, the IFV as it does fire your infantry units weapon, will be a special case.

 

The battle fortress, will have to be tested, we dont know if the veterancy of the unit will depend on the driver or the individual gunners yet.

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Guest ghhyrd

Guest ghhyrd

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Damn, show us the nuke silo in the background you fool!

 

Please!

 

Sorry for the fool comment, but I must see more! Its all very good by the way, thanks guise and TheKGBSpy!

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Guest Xenon560

Guest Xenon560

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I kinda agree with cmatt

 

I recon it should be that any points gathered as an infantry shouldnt count as points for vehicles

 

e.g.

 

I'm a flak trooper with 30 therefore I'm and elite flak trooper, so infantry wise i have 30 points but when i get in an Apoc Tank i wont have any vehicle points so i will hav to gather another 30 points by damaging or killing units/buildings in the tank to become a veteran

 

And lets say i got 60 points in the tank and i got out i would still only have 30 points with my flak trooper but if then i get in another tank like a Rhino Tank i would have 60 points in the rhino tank making my rhino an elite.

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Guest EVA-251

Guest EVA-251

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I am just curious, would that method I proposed be impossible to implement in the Renegade engine? It would be more true to RA2.

 

And the Battle Fortress turrets wont show up as targets or will be considered part of the vehicle in the final version, right?

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