Games [Game Over] CYOR - Halloween Edition

[Jeod]

1 minute ago, TheIrishman said:

Resolving:

Alstar tries to Sense Nodlied's background only feel the most profound aura of death.

[Jeod]

Cat5 is Neutral. He is able to learn about the roles of other players, but he portrayed Nodlied as town in order to save his own skin. Otherwise, scum would just nightkill him. There is zero explanation for Nodlied's claim of "free hugs", and I don't know what sort of positive hugs would have an aura of death.

##vote Nodlied

[Alstar]

Im not joining the vote until i hear what i want to hear.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

No fucking way. Nodlied is town. I said he's town because he is town. Don't make up a story on my motivations. I don't have to be afraid of scum. The worst they can do to me is lynch me, or win/lose while I'm out of the loop.

I attempted to jail kamuixmod. Wound up jailing Nodlied instead.

Nodlied should be able to confirm this in the same way Jeod confirmed my last action.

By the way, since I did jail Nodlied, this means he cannot be the killer either. Killing_You and Alstar are the only options.

[Killing_You]

Ho. Ly. Shit. Cat5, I owe you a HUGE apology, m8.

Anyway, Alstar's report is interesting, as I didn't get a report of being visited. I attempted to cast my sigil on Jeod, wound up being redirected to Jeod. This, to me, is an open and shut case, as I had predicted. Here's the case file, in case you have doubts:

FRAYDO'S EVIDENCE

Spoiler

On 11/5/2017 at 1:58 AM, FRAYDO said:

To my dear, beloved Alstar; indeed I did visit you. I suppose thanks are in order to the bus driver/randomizer who made that happen, so thank you whoever you are. My visit seems to tell of me of something interesting, wouldn't you know? According to my findings, Alstar is Mafia!

Do I have a case for you. I intended to visit Killing You but let's run with this result instead then.

Day 2 - Page 9
Orange and Alstar start the day off, posts within minutes of one another. Voe is quick to catch on.

Page 10
Alstar claims that no one visited Category5, and that was all the information he could share. Granted, Alstar would later receive a corrected PM that someone actually did visit Cat5, which was me by redirection. At this point, I question your intention on watching Category5. Was it to debunk his claim? Unsure if he was a valid nightkill target for the night? Seems to me Alstar wanted to keep a close eye on their perceived threat while Orange went for the kill on another.

One thing that interests me beside Alstar is Jeod speaking up here, page 10. Seems to have hit the nail on the head of the one-time BP that prevented the kill, but wonders what scum can gain from Alstar's claim. Jeod would later on page 11 cross Alstar off of the suspect list, going along with Alstar's report being pro-town. This seems suspicious to me, and seems more like Jeod clearing his scum buddy.

Bringing the case back to Alstar. As we all know turned out to be mafia, Orange turned out to be mafia. What's interesting then is his player reads list. This I'll include in a quote than directing to the page, for observation as our mafia laid out his list.

Orange is sure to leave Alstar with a Town read and provided reasoning, with a touch of "almost downgraded to neutral" for distancing. Particularly interested in others' thoughts on the list, given our last lynch.

Page 16
Alstar jumps on Orange's proposed suspicion toward me and offers more information on me. Before I forget to mention it in this post, let it be known he never shared this information despite town being all ears.

 

Still waiting.

Page 17
Things are going south for Orange, so Alstar proposes Orange be checked as well alongside me.

Page 18
Alstar claims a day ability to check someone and casually reminds us that he is able. I'm apprehensive that Alstar will use this ability on me, though I am not sure that would be scum's best move.

 

I welcome you to try checking me. We have already nailed one mafia and you taking any action against me will only seal your fate, Alstar. Category5 has returned to us, which clears me and therefore puts my alignment checks in full trust.

##vote Alstar

 

MY EVIDENCE

Spoiler

On 11/5/2017 at 9:20 PM, Killing You said:

But the question remains: How does Alstar fit into this?

Let's say he has a second night ability, and he's telling the truth here. What would be the most possible scenario for Alstar here?

Well, let's say my ability didn't go haywire, but Alstar wasn't affected by the randomizer. He's already claimed a passive that let's him see who visited him at night. It's possible that he did watch Cat5 N1 while Orange went for the kill (and failed, as we saw), but with Orange gone, went for Choppy last night and claimed to have watched himself by accident?* He would have all the information he needed to make a false claim and save his own arse. Unfortunately for him, FRAYDO managed to discover his true colors before being run down accidentally.

*Amendment: Based on the information given to us by kam's flip, it seems as though Alstar likely tried to kill someone else and got redirected to ChopBam, and then made the false claim on top of that.

CATEGORY 5 HURRICANE'S EVIDENCE

Spoiler

18 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Now, for the rest. Jeod was jailed by me. He didn't do the nightkill on ChopBam. He's Town.
Because of Killing_You, Alstar visited himself. We seem to know this because Alstar knows exactly who visited him, which was FRAYDO and Killing_You.
This means that both people I suspect could have killed ChopBam are already tied up doing other actions. What's the deal?

Killing_You might be the explanation for this. If his target is sending multiple actions, does each action have a chance of being reflected separately? If this is true, then Alstar could get the nightkill out while having his watcher role reflected. This would be consistent with the fact that I was attacked N1, and Alstar also watched me at the same time. The other option is that Killing_You split his actions, but I have nothing that supports that argument.

Because there is no evidence that anybody was bussed N2, I believe FRAYDO's result was accurate. kamuixmod and I were bussed N1 as I covered before.

Combining these all these points makes me reasonably confident that Alstar is Mafia, and Killing_You is Town.

 

VOE'S EVIDENCE

Spoiler

On 11/1/2017 at 5:15 PM, Voe said:

Alstar, Orange, you're both very quick to respond and flood the topic. A feint scent of coordination fills my nostrils. 

 

##vote Alstar

Also, since we're down to just a few players:

##vote 24 hour day phase

[Killing_You]

 

17 minutes ago, Killing You said:

I attempted to cast my sigil on Jeod, wound up being redirected to Jeod.

Oh derp, I realize what I typed. Meant to say "tried to cast on Nodlied, wound up being redirected to Jeod."

[Alstar]

I like how Cat5 evades the contradictions about what he wrote last night. Nice meme m8. Just when i thought that town finally started using their brains, this happens. 

Cat5, have you got info about being observed n1? If no then why I have reported FRAYDO visiting you? 

"B-but Alstar, y-you could h-have just t-taken i-i-info p-provided b-by F-F-RAYDO f-for y-your a-advantage" 

Yeah right. I totally done that. I talked it behind game with TIM to make him tell everyone that there was small issue with my night pm so ican kill in peace while scoring towm points. Because i totally done that beside the fact that I didn't. Find your way or if your own contradictons first, then date to talk about the others. 

 

Also, did you just claimed total night kill immunity? 

[Alstar]

Brb getting my "Confidence of Cat5 kills a townie" tip jar from previous game. 

[Category 5 Hurricane]

You have reported that FRAYDO visited the same target as you watched. That does not mean that you watched me. Given that we now have proof that I was bussed with kamuixmod as FRAYDO cannot have gotten a Third Party result otherwise, we know that somebody has a bus driver action of some sort. That action does not appear to have been triggered N2, so I currently think it's kamuixmod's passive. (He complained about not being visited N2, nobody seemed to be bussed N2, might be connected)

IF THE BUSSER IS STILL ALIVE AND BUSSED ALSTAR WITH ANYONE ELSE NIGHT 2, YOU NEED TO SPEAK UP RIGHT NOW. We also need to look for evidence that anyone was bussed today. Action claims that don't match might be evidence of this.

ChopBam tracked me, but I did not receive a message saying that he did so (nor did anybody claim to after N2) so either the Tracker doesn't alert the target, or I didn't get told that because I didn't do anything for ChopBam to track. Meanwhile, kamuixmod claimed to have been watched.

And wouldn't you know, I put all that together along with the fact that only a Third Party player could have known it was MYLO yesterday, and then kamuixmod flips Third Party. Total shocker.

 

I'm still looking at Killing_You as well. I'm reminded that OrangeP47 took a shot at Killing_You for reasons that are no longer apparent to me. KY shooting FRAYDO would have been beneficial to Mafia. Why didn't OrangeP47 just let it go? Was that just an attempt at distancing from his teammate?

 

Furthermore, Jeod hasn't managed to keep his thinking consistent over the last couple days. During the night, he called Killing_You town because he tried to kill Alstar, but also called Alstar town because he thinks Alstar was bussed. If Nodlied is town, Jeod is town, Killing_You is town, and Alstar is town, there are too many town. I already proved that there are three town remaining and it can't be any other number.

Nodlied is locked town to me because I investigated him, and my investigation was confirmed accurate to at least the flavor due to Alstar. I know everything he can do.
I'm pretty sure Jeod is town, but I see wiggle room for a scenario where it might be possible that he can make unblockable kills, which leaves the possibility open.

As long as mafia is among Killing_You and Alstar, victory is at hand. We get one wrong, it's fine, lynch the other. The big task for me today is going to be eliminating Jeod from the suspect list, because that is the one situation that will make me uncomfortable, if I'm sitting there at the final 3 with Killing_You or Alstar and Jeod as the only two left and my mind is still nagging me about Jeod.

 

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Total nightkill immunity? No. Being nightkilled sends me away for a while where I can't participate and also potentially make it harder to complete my secondary objective (which is why I set up a situation to complete that objective right away). If the game ends while I'm still in an alternate history, I lose.

[Alstar]

2 minutes ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

You have reported that FRAYDO visited the same target as you watched. That does not mean that you watched me.

FRAYDO reported visit on Cat5. Alstar reports FRAYDO visitng Cat5. Therefore Alstar and FRAYDO visited different target but not Cat5.

This is most retarded claim i have ever seen. I know what my result PM wrote. Are you sure you havent left your brain in alternate dimension?

You know what, im tired of this bullshit. Town deserves to lose. You, whatever your alignment is, deserve to lose.
##vote Alstar
##vote24hourday
##voteearlyhammer

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Do you know how bussing works?

[Alstar]

If i was bussed, then why i only returned my action on different target only during D2?

[Alstar]

Doesn't matter anyway. Im off to mount my new PC. You guys figure it out by yourselves.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

When a two players are bussed, the people making actions on those players are not told that they visited the wrong target. You were told about your action being directly modified to target me, but you were not told that I was switched with kamuixmod.

FRAYDO got a Third Party result because he actually visited kamuixmod
You saw FRAYDO visit kamuixmod because you also visited kamuixmod
kamuixmod felt he was watched by someone, because you watched him

ChopBam tracked me and saw that I didn't do anything
I was not alerted that anyone tracked me, though I was attacked.
Outside of kamuixmod, who was actually watched, nobody has claimed to have been tracked by ChopBam, probably because TheIrishman decided to not have trackers alert the target

It all matches up this way.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Otherwise we're left with the "insane FRAYDO cop" idea, which is itself insane. I've never heard of an insane cop that gives Third Party results on Neutral Players, and then we have to explain why nobody was tracked by ChopBam on N2, and why I didn't recieve a report for being watched N1.

[Alstar]

Chopbam didnt track you during that night. You're talking about N1, right? He tracked Orange but got redirected to Kam.

[Alstar]

Im going off. Hopefully someone will end my misery. And you guys will be posting "I was wrong".

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Listen.

kamuixmod and I were bussed on Night 1. This means reported actions actually occurred on the opposite player.

Anything that supposedly hit kamuixmod actually hit me.

Anything that supposedly hit me actually hit kamuixmod.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Are you perhaps stuck on this idea because you used a nightkill on me, and it still hit me? Perhaps that nightkill has a modifier that makes it so that it will not fail to hit the original target. Why don't you check that out for me?

[Category 5 Hurricane]

If we're wrong, who is it? Stop throwing a hissy fit at me and build a case. You seemed to be waiting for something earlier. I suspected it was waiting for Killing_You. He replied and contradicted your claim. Why are you not talking about this?

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Killing_You, since you claim to have done an action on Jeod, can you tell me what the hypothetical results would be if Jeod was the person attempting a nightkill while you did that action?

[Jeod]

Your explanation for FRAYDO's cop reports is that players don't know when they're bussed, thus receiving Target B's report for Target A. I'm pretty sure that's bullshit and I'm going to have to read a lot of pages to verify.

[Jeod]

Working on it now, but here's a bone to chew on:

Case Files

Point A – Alstar’s visit to me and redirect to KY

Neither I nor KY received a PM stating that we felt like we were being watched. This means that ChopBam is the source of that line or KY is lying.

[Jeod]

##unvote

##vote Killing You

[Jeod]

Case Files

Point A – Alstar’s visit to me and redirect to KY

Neither I nor KY received a PM stating that we felt like we were being watched. This means that ChopBam is the source of that line.

Point B – Night One’s Bussing

Category 5 Hurricane was targeted for a night kill, which is why he was phased out of the game for a day. Alstar watched Cat5, and reports only FRAYDO as a visitor. FRAYDO attempted to visit OrangeP47, but instead wound up visiting Cat5. ChopBam attempted to track OrangeP47, but instead tracked Kamuixmod. Kamuixmod states his PM told him he was being watched.

*Killing You made the nightkill, not OrangeP47. OrangeP47 was messing with FRAYDO but meant to visit ChopBam.

FRAYDO reports his N1 returned a third party result on Cat5.

Point C – Night Two’s Bussing

Alstar tries to watch ChopBam, instead watched himself. FRAYDO and KY both visited Alstar. FRAYDO states he intended to visit KY, but wound up directed to Alstar with a mafia result.

*This means that if Cat5’s theory is true, that KY visited ChopBam and FRAYDO visited KY, and both were redirected to Alstar, but retained their original results (a successful nightkill, and a mafia report).

FRAYDO admits that he believes third party and neutral alignments are interchangeable, and does not clarify which is said in his PM.

Killing You tries to incinerate Alstar rather than incinerate the mistakenly resurrected OrangeP47, the confirmed mafia.

[Jeod]

Night Three's Bussing

Alstar says he tried to watch me but got redirected to KY. Nobody visited me, which validates his report.

[Jeod]

@Category 5 Hurricane, I've been all over the place with my reads for this game because I publish my compiled information and theories nearly as soon as I consider them. I do this to keep town in the loop and also to crowdsource my information. I keep looking while my published theories are discussed, and when I'm ready to alter or reinforce my view, I read the discussion to ensure I haven't missed anything.

[Jeod]

I am also open to a 24 hour day phase.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

We're mixing up terms here. Having targets changed by kamuixmod's known passive is different than bussing, because we're being told of the changed targets.

Bussing swaps players, not targets. I can't recall a game I've played with a bus driver where players affected by the bus driver knew about the effects. A search of the mafiawiki I pointed TheIrishman to says there isn't a consensus on the idea. However, same wiki does not include a variation of a cop role that would have an insane cop return Third Party on a Neutral, and therefore I think a bus driver exists. I think it was triggered by someone visiting kamuixmod and his hidden passive.

If we think a bus driver is responsible for Alstar showing up as Mafia on N2, then we have to figure out who the other person was who was bussed. Same way I figured out kamuixmod was Third Party.

Such a thing seems far fetched, though. This would mean that FRAYDO randomly picked the same target as someone who was bussed two times in a row, and it couldn't even be planned that way due to the randomizer.

...

Good lord, that really does make me think that "insane" makes more sense even though I've seen no precedent for that.

 

Killing_You, please explain why you attempted to target Nodlied when I gave him vague instructions to stop the nightkill?