Event [Complete] RA:APB-themed Mafia game III

[Jeod]

That gimmicky war factory is more of a building than you are right now. But that is a good point. I'm sure we all had more vote totals than Cat5 yesterday and nothing happened. Unless the chrono thing is what happened.

[VERTi60]

##Vote Cat5

[Vote Counted] Nodlied voted Category 5 Hurricane to be lynched!

 

Time Left:

1 day(s) , 0 hours, 46 min, 23 sec

 

CVC:

Category 5 Hurricane voted nobody

Chaos_Knight voted Nodlied

Jeod voted nobody

Killing You voted Nodlied

Nodlied voted Category 5 Hurricane

Wallymoon715 voted nobody

 

3/6 votes casted so far

Nodlied has the most votes - 2

[Chaos_Knight]

At this point I am just going to stop beating around the bust and say it in the open.

I have full suspicion that there's a hostile building role in the game. It's just too many of us, concrete folk, around for all of them to be town.

[Jeod]

Alright, lunch break! Well, dinner for me. Anyway, I have three possible outcomes for this puzzle. I'll elaborate more on them when asked about specific ones, but I might not get to them until later tonight or tomorrow before my next shift.

 

1) Category5 and ChopBam are a scumteam. This is supported by the gamebreaking balance issues that come with a Soviet War Factory. Logically, it just doesn't work unless Allies are in the game and they have a rocket soldier. Category5 is an Allied factory and produced a chronotank for ChopBam. This is supported by ChopBam being the only one able to confirm Category5's role for the time being. Nodlied, then, is either a Soviet building or a visceroid.

 

2) Nodlied is a chronosphere, which would explain the lack of nightkills as buildings cannot visit. This is also the easiest outcome.

 

3) Nodlied, Moonsense, or Killing_You are actually a chrono legionnaire.

 

As Chaos_Night says, Nodlied being a chronosphere is the easiest and most simple outcome. We would have to discard the notion that scum buildings cannot exist.

Here are my proposed solutions to the issue:

 

We shoot both Cat5 and Nodlied, either at the same time or by a vote for who gets shot first.

 

If by some act of divine RNGesus trickery neither are Allies, then we have only two targets remaining.

Mafia edit: Note: these theories all operate within the absolute FACT that a chrono-power is among us.

[Chaos_Knight]

As Chaos_Night says, Nodlied being a chronosphere is the easiest and most simple outcome. We would have to discard the notion that scum buildings cannot exist.

Em, where did I say that Nodlied is a chronosphere? I think you are trying to make it look like I said something I didn't.

[Jeod]

 

As Chaos_Night says with the Allies having a building role, Nodlied being a chronosphere is the easiest and most simple outcome. We would have to discard the notion that scum buildings cannot exist.

Em, where did I say that Nodlied is a chronosphere? I think you are trying to make it look like I said something I didn't.

 

 

You didn't. I could have written that sentence better. Changes in bold to show what I meant.

[moonsense715]

Monday huh? Not much chatting happened today. I agree that the amount of building claims is disturbing >.>

 

Nodlied, Jeod is under mother russia's protection so don't try to shadow him

Also you aren't acting like a patriot like in the other games you were soviet. You're turning the whole "I won't be available" argument as an excuse/in favor of remaining silent. I'd consider this a valid tactic myself.

 

If you are a soviet building then what's the problem with lynching you? It'd tell if you are a building or not. Although I have a problem if allies can be unlynchable buildings, because if the dice rolls all come out bad for shooting then the Allies have a chance of being invulnerable. Guys: Can any type of shooting kill a building? (or only RPG soldiers/shock troopers/whatever the players came up with this game?)

If Chaos_Knight can refill weapons then that means allied buildings can eventually get killed if shooting a building can kill it. So if either Nodlied or Cat5 is an allied building, no hopes lost. If the same happens but CK is NOT a gun-refiller, we're in deep shit.

 

Jeod, you're not really appreciating my unquestioned protection towards you, this makes me sad

You claimed to be a Flame Tower but I don't recall you shooting yet. Or maybe I just missed it in the 20 pages of way too much info. If you didn't shoot yet, why are you waiting/ordering others to do it eventually? If you did shoot, please link me to that post.

 

 

P.S. I have a feeling that we might see ChopBam phase back into the game

[Jeod]

Monday huh? Not much chatting happened today. I agree that the amount of building claims is disturbing >.>

 

Nodlied, Jeod is under mother russia's protection so don't try to shadow him

Also you aren't acting like a patriot like in the other games you were soviet. You're turning the whole "I won't be available" argument as an excuse/in favor of remaining silent. I'd consider this a valid tactic myself.

 

If you are a soviet building then what's the problem with lynching you? It'd tell if you are a building or not. Although I have a problem if allies can be unlynchable buildings, because if the dice rolls all come out bad for shooting then the Allies have a chance of being invulnerable. Guys: Can any type of shooting kill a building? (or only RPG soldiers/shock troopers/whatever the players came up with this game?)

If Chaos_Knight can refill weapons then that means allied buildings can eventually get killed if shooting a building can kill it. So if either Nodlied or Cat5 is an allied building, no hopes lost. If the same happens but CK is NOT a gun-refiller, we're in deep shit.

 

Jeod, you're not really appreciating my unquestioned protection towards you, this makes me sad

You claimed to be a Flame Tower but I don't recall you shooting yet. Or maybe I just missed it in the 20 pages of way too much info. If you didn't shoot yet, why are you waiting/ordering others to do it eventually? If you did shoot, please link me to that post.

 

 

P.S. I have a feeling that we might see ChopBam phase back into the game

I shot and missed Mojoman a day ago. As for my not appreciating your loyalty, well, objectively, expressing undying loyalty isn't a good idea in a mafia game. For example, I'm not groveling at CK's feet. We understand who is clear and who is not, and we search for scum.

 

Regarding Nodlied. We already know he is a building based on his quotes a while back. There is no point in lynching him unless any shots fired on him miss.

[moonsense715]

I've found the shooting, thanks. Day 3 opener.

Right, so if you are certain Nodlied is a building and suspect him as being Allied, then why are we trying to lynch him (leads with 2 votes ATM)? In fact, if he's the only Allied player left and we have to lynch someone not him, that would only make our outpost personnel smaller or result in nothing.

Why? Let's see again:
Category 5 Hurricane: we decided he's a building (war factory, allied/soviet, you accused him being possibly allied)
Chaos_Knight we decided he's a building (soviet barracks/gun refiller)
Jeod: lynching you was impossible. I cannot guess custom roles but no default allied role can stop a lynch (only a shot, the medic). So I'll take that as you are a building.
Killing You: guy seems to be townie, I'll read more pages tomorrow. Seriously, how many pages have you guys filled before I joined? ARGH
Nodlied: claims to be a building.
Wallymoon715: I am not a building. Neither am I Wallymoon >.> x.x But I'll accept it if that makes Verti happy

So let's say we accept all of the above, the only people who are not buildings here are KY and myself. On the other hand, both townies. Let's not lynch townies OK?

There is no point in lynching him unless any shots fired on him miss.

So building shots never fail if the weapon wasn't stuck?

 

Anyway, since I suck at this game, to me it looks like we either lynch a building today (else KY (I trust him as townie) or I die ) or we actually start making cases for which building to shoot. Yes I know that this is only if all the claims I listed above are true, but the complication of possibilities here made my head hurt in the past 4 hours now >.>

[Jeod]

We must choose who out of Nodlied or Cat5 to shoot. If the shots fail to kill the intended target, we try lynching them as neither Cat5 nor Nodlied have been proven building via lynch.

[moonsense715]

Can someone address my other questions please? I think even Verti would be OK to answer some since they are generic, not current-game related.

 

Another Q: would it be stupid if allies had a base defense? (building with shoot ability)

[Category 5 Hurricane]

If we're working the angle that there is a Allied Building, then that doesn't clear Jeod, either, especially since he's claimed a building from the role list and has now claimed two aspects to that role that do not match that role.

 

Moony, a weapon shot works like this:

 

You use your action. No matter what happens after this, you cannot do it again.

 

Depending on the stats of the weapon, there is a dice roll to check if your weapon jams (called stuck for some reason). If it doesn't jam, he rolls again to see if you miss or hit the target. If you hit the target, you will kill the target unless the unit has something that protects him. For example, a Rifle Soldier could have protected himself the previous night, which would protect him during that day as well. Buildings do not necessarily have bullet proofing. I've never seen one that did. Could be possible if a role was handing it out.

[Jeod]

If we're working the angle that there is a Allied Building, then that doesn't clear Jeod, either, especially since he's claimed a building from the role list and has now claimed two aspects to that role that do not match that role.

 

Moony, a weapon shot works like this:

 

You use your action. No matter what happens after this, you cannot do it again.

 

Depending on the stats of the weapon, there is a dice roll to check if your weapon jams (called stuck for some reason). If it doesn't jam, he rolls again to see if you miss or hit the target. If you hit the target, you will kill the target unless the unit has something that protects him. For example, a Rifle Soldier could have protected himself the previous night, which would protect him during that day as well. Buildings do not necessarily have bullet proofing. I've never seen one that did. Could be possible if a role was handing it out.

You're insistent on getting me killed and it's hilarious. Name the two things. I only mentioned one and it's a basic given--that I'll shoot third party infantry who visit me as well as Allies.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

The other is that you have a second shot. Which you aren't using despite the fact you've been telling others to do so.

You aren't my top suspect right now, by the way.

You just keep saying things that flag my attention. For example, arguments being used against others that could easily be used on self, without mentioning self.

[Jeod]

I never said I had a second shot. I recall saying specifically that I don't have a second shot. It's in a post all by itself.

And of course they could be used on myself. I haven't made it a point to count myself out of that. But, seeing as I am Soviet, I'm not going to bother mentioning it.

[moonsense715]

If we're working the angle that there is a Allied Building, then that doesn't clear Jeod, either,...

This is why I'm asking if allies can have a base defense, as he did shoot before and couldn't be lynched. It's 2:30 am and I can't decide if this would make it nigh-impossible for soviets to win or it is not the case at all. Can someone convince me please?

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I never said I had a second shot. I recall saying specifically that I don't have a second shot. It's in a post all by itself.

And of course they could be used on myself. I haven't made it a point to count myself out of that. But, seeing as I am Soviet, I'm not going to bother mentioning it.

Oh, you're right, I misread that.

I'm not convinced that there is a building on the Allied team. However, I do wonder if someone could fake being a building.

[Jeod]

 

If we're working the angle that there is a Allied Building, then that doesn't clear Jeod, either,...

 

This is why I'm asking if allies can have a base defense, as he did shoot before and couldn't be lynched. It's 2:30 am and I can't decide if this would make it nigh-impossible for soviets to win or it is not the case at all. Can someone convince me please?

I suppose from looking outside inward, it could be argued that I might be a Pillbox or Turret. But, what's the point of that? I wouldn't be able to visit, and with half of the Soviets building roles, they wouldn't be able to visit me to be shot at. It doesn't make sense to give Allies a base defense role.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

It also doesn't make sense that the Allied team would be made of anything but infantry if your role is true. I'm sitting here where I have to base my argument off of game meta, but I don't believe there is a mafia building role, so for now I have to believe Jeod. If I do, Nodlied is the prime suspect, because his claim was last and most convenient, and unproven.

 

By the way, Killing_You, you accepted an invite from Chaos. What did it do and how do you know?

[Jeod]

Category5, I've asked earlier today for your entire thoughts on this puzzle, including what you interpret as fact and what circumstantial events the unknowns must have in order to fit into the puzzle. Would you care to post such?

It also doesn't make sense that the Allied team would be made of anything but infantry if your role is true. I'm sitting here where I have to base my argument off of game meta, but I don't believe there is a mafia building role, so for now I have to believe Jeod. If I do, Nodlied is the prime suspect, because his claim was last and most convenient, and unproven.

 

By the way, Killing_You, you accepted an invite from Chaos. What did it do and how do you know?

He said he received a second shot from Chaos. He didn't mention whether it was for the same gun or if he has a new chance percentage.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I think I just did that, but I can elaborate more if you want. I'll be sitting down to post a long review tonight, but I can do a short version now. By the way, I said cumulative vote total. That means the entire game. The closest person to surpassing that was ChopBam. Yes, I have been tracking it.

 

Currently, I'm locking you down as town. I'm not sure it's valid to do this as my only argument for doing so is game meta and I've got a lot of behavioral reasons to go after you, but I'm doing it anyway.

If I lock you down as town, and myself town, and Chaos town (which I can do because he visited me), there remains only Nodlied, Killing_You, and Moony. I currently do not believe we are in a position where we would lose instantly on the next death, or it would have happened by now. So we have one miss. That means 4 vs 2. Or 3 vs 1 vs 1.

 

If I believe your claim, then the Allies must be infantry units. Wouldn't make sense for them to be anything else.

 

In short: primary reason for suspecting Nodlied: Didn't know how Chaos's role worked. Only claimed why after it became convenient.

In short: primary reason for suspecting Killing_You: Has claimed infantry in a game that apparently must contain an allied infantry. Also claimed a tank killing role that roleblocks everything while I make tanks. Has also been eager to follow most every vote train this game.

In short: primary reason for suspecting Moony: First night after his arrival resulted in the first apparent night kill, which I am interpreting as the use of a janitor role.

 

Of course, if I don't believe that Jeod is a building as he says, that all falls apart. It would fall much better into my behavioral arguments if Jeod was not-town as he has continuously presented anti-town arguments all game.

For example, Jeod is eager to kill someone who claims building or lynch someone who claims he isn't. If we are 4 vs 2, getting this wrong means a loss for us. However, holding fire and lynching someone who we think is a building will keep the game 4 vs 2, mafia will reduce it to 3 vs 2, and then we'll have a more clear picture with which to argue about.

[Jeod]

The only one who has claimed I may not be a building is you so far, and that was after I started thinking of you as an Allied building. I don't call that eager.

 

If you're suggesting we lynch a building claim to keep the count safe for today, that could work. We have to consider, though: Killing_You and Moonsense have guns. There's the chance they miss their shot and put themselves into autoloss by outing, but if there's another chronoshift tonight or a regular kill, then their guns have more impact.

[moonsense715]

Food for thought:
Mojoman successfully bit Nodlied on Day 3.

Can buildings be bitten by Visceroids? If not then Nod lied.

[Jeod]

As for my behavior, as I said before I don't like to rely on player meta and prefer to draw my conclusions through fact. That is why especially after two nights of no deaths I felt comfortable getting things into the open and asking questions.

Food for thought:

Mojoman successfully bit Nodlied on Day 3.

Can buildings be bitten by Visceroids? If not then Nod lied.

This is possible, but it will mean Nodlied is not a building, and will also mean there is another Allied player among us. Visceroids cannot chronoshift, unless things got really wacky.

[moonsense715]

Food for thought #2:
What happened to Cat5 forced to doing votes in a lot of his posts? That seems to have stopped. Why?

[Jeod]

Food for thought #2:

What happened to Cat5 forced to doing votes in a lot of his posts? That seems to have stopped. Why?

He just explained it. Apparently, he must have the highest cumulative vote count among all the players in this game and has been tracking it. Only ChopBam has come close so far, which is why Cat5 does not need to vote every post.

Sure doesn't sound like something a factory would have though.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I believe that bite action would work on anyone. The result was announced, and it blocked Nodlied just like the Guard Dog role would have. I don't think it was a day conversion, and we've seen no evidence of this continuing. Furthermore, if there was more than 1 third party left in the game, the game probably would be over by now.

 

I explained the voting in full detail earlier. I never voted in every post in any day. I simply needed to have a higher cumulative vote total than everyone else. (Probably a nod to me suggesting the mandatory voting system). I do have a potentially powerful role, so I guess it helps balance it.

[moonsense715]

I still think that biting a building sounds stupid. Although I'm thinking with a game developer mind.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Don't start thinking APB game logic. A spy can kill a building in this game.

[Killing_You]

By the way, Killing_You, you accepted an invite from Chaos. What did it do and how do you know?

 

I was given an option to either refill my weapon or train a new class. I chose the latter, because the Shockie has crap accuracy (except vs vehicles) and it's obvious that we're not dealing with just vehicles here.

 

At this point, I'm flip-flopping between Nodlied and Jeod. Leaning towards Nodlied, as Jeod was unlynchable, and having unlynchable scum still makes little sense to me.