Event [DAY 9 - Game End] Death Note themed Detective Mafia Forum Game

[Chaos_Knight]

1 minute ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I don't believe Voe's claim at all. Frankly, I think he's trolling.

Wouldn't be the first time him doing it. Esp. to completely dumb down everyone's attention towards whatever he's saying.

[Jeod]

9 minutes ago, Chaos_Knight said:

Shinigami eyes AFAIK aren't given by default, they cost half of one's lifespan. And they work well. Way too well, since you only need to see person's upper half of the face to know their name. According to the lore at least. My best bet is that Kira either need an investigation on the target or something equally as "mod-confirming" to kill.

Also by your logic, me looking into people's posts, looking for slips and trying to get stuff going is "scummy". Okay then. I guess I should return the favor.

##vote Cat5

I don't recall you having mentioned that you're a fan of the series or have seen it. It's a bit of a poor reason, but technically one could say that your advanced knowledge of things like Shinigami Eyes is suspect. That's something I would expect Kira to know about in a PM.

8 minutes ago, OrangeP47 said:

I'll admit, it's not a complete theory, but it's why I'm so hesitant. I'll present two possibilities.

1) Kira knows who we are, but for some reason didn't N1 because it'd have somehow been suspicious, or he needs people not allied with him to do certain things, and he'll only kill once they've outlived their usefulness. I'll admit, I have nothing to support this idea, but I fail to see how meeting 1 on 1 (or small groups) is sufficiently distinct from our big group meeting of everyone right now.

Or

2) Because the meta has changed, Kira doesn't know who his supporters actually are, kind of like large games of Secret Hitler. He couldn't just randomly kill because he might hit someone with a compatible goal, and he needs to figure their goal out first.

These also have one big factor at play too and also all my other thinking:  The real Kira is stated to be an NPC right now, so we're dealing with a proxy, like Misa or someone (I'm going to just say Misa for ease of coversation). It's possible Kira knows all, but Misa is the active killer, and they can't actively talk right now, so there's a disconnect of information on the scum side. Or Misa could see everyone's name with Shinigami eyes, but doesn't have accurate 'orders' on who she needs to kill, etc. This type of setup with so many differeny motives is great for several different mafias or having third parties or what not. In summary, and I'll bold this as it's the important part and I'm really kind of rambling: I don't think the scum side are in full communication with each other. Again, though, my rationale for believing this is thinking that someone *does* know our identities, is responsible for Voe's odd behavior, but has not laid into the town full bore yet for some strange reason. The bold is what my guess at the 'some strange reason' is.

1) I think Kira is dependent on investigation, or was. I do think he has or will have other means of discovering names and faces, but didn't begin with those means.

2) The true Kira (Light) does not care about supporters and uses them as a means to an end. There's probably no "secret Hitler" thing involved.

3) I'm adding a third number to your list of theories, and that is that the current Kira in this game has no memory of being Kira. That is, the current Kira does not currently possess a Death Note. This is more unlikely than the rest, because it would all but confirm a Shinigami exists in this game (they are the origin of the notebooks).

[OrangeP47]

Just now, Jeod said:

2) The true Kira (Light) does not care about supporters and uses them as a means to an end. There's probably no "secret Hitler" thing involved.

3) I'm adding a third number to your list of theories, and that is that the current Kira in this game has no memory of being Kira. That is, the current Kira does not currently possess a Death Note. This is more unlikely than the rest, because it would all but confirm a Shinigami exists in this game (they are the origin of the notebooks).

2) I agree, but he'd still want them to serve their purpose, first. You may throw away a napkin after eating lunch, but you don't buy them at the store and throw them straight in the trash.

3) I was thinking that too, but didn't know quite how to say it, so I skipped it. I was feeling pressured by the time limit we all thought was here.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Do I have to post the requirements for use of the Death Note again?

[Jeod]

Just now, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Do I have to post the requirements for use of the Death Note again?

Names and faces yada yada yada. Its been posted a million times and it should be understood by now that it means Kira must know which player has which role and that it must be officially uncovered (not simply correctly guessed).

[OrangeP47]

We aren't arguing over those rules. We're aruging over whether or not their alternative ways of getting a name and face. Needing a name and a face is mind numbingly obvious. How you get a name and a face has been rather nebulously laid out, however.

[Jeod]

Arguing that is pointless. Beyond daytime investigation, we can't possibly know what other means there are or how exactly the eyes work. The only way to know me is to try more. It might be helpful to summarize what ChopBam has said he needs and try to figure out if it's a good thing or a bad thing, and then narrow down who will meet with him.

[VERTi60]

36 minutes ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

##vote Chaos_Knight

[Vote Counted] Category 5 Hurricane voted Chaos_Knight to be lynched!
 

20 minutes ago, Chaos_Knight said:

##vote Cat5

[Vote Counted] Chaos_Knight voted Category 5 Hurricane to be lynched!
 

[OrangeP47]

Sorry Jeod, that was more directed at Cat 5, I guess I should quote more. I'm mostly in agreement with you.

I'm simply saying that Kira and company could have more resources at their disposal than we're aware of, and it would be foolish to assume we're safe.

[Chaos_Knight]

Just now, Jeod said:

I don't recall you having mentioned that you're a fan of the series or have seen it. It's a bit of a poor reason, but technically one could say that your advanced knowledge of things like Shinigami Eyes is suspect. That's something I would expect Kira to know about in a PM.

I actually watched the whole thing about 5 years ago. Also google.com and the wikia work wonders.

As for the rest of the points.

1. Seems like the most balanced solution there.

2. Seems highly unlikely. Not only Kira indeed cares only about his own ego (IIRC), we also have a "Confirmed role" graph in the CVC. This hints at 1 a lot.

3. Would actually prevent catching Kira D1 in a pretty smart way. And Shinigami can't be stopped because he can't be investigated or even tracked. *Cough* *Cough*

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I disagree. It seems pretty obvious to me. It says by investigation (which we know), night action (so a scum role cop role), or some other action (which sounds like doc access to me).

The fact that the names must be revealed means that the Kira can't just choose a player and shoot. Can't. Which is to say, it isn't that it is risky to do so without knowing who it is, they can't. Which is probably why no death occurred N1. If we had investigated someone who was "town" on N1, that person would be dead now (unless the Kira/Deathnote combo doesn't actually exist yet, I suppose). The Kira might know someone's name now, but I doubt it. Nobody seems to have had any action done to them...other than me maybe? I still have an extra 25 points that I don't know anything about...and nobody apparently knew they could visit during the night.

Along those lines, I now wonder if I'm actually the person ChopBam is looking for since I'm the only one that seems to potentially have had an action done on himself.

 

[OrangeP47]

And I still contest that if Kira had Shinigami eyes (which may be a purchase, and therefore qualify as an action, I'd wager, which would delay things I suppose) he could indeed fire from the hip. The thing is, there can be multiple Death Notes I'd also wager, or the person with Shinigami eyes has lent the Death Note for whatever reason (lending does not induce amnesia, as 'losing' it does), or some other reason for scum communication disconnect.

It's fine to disagree with this, and others believe some aspects of it to be unlikely, but I feel as if we're developing a false sense of security when that's a bad thing. If we played a game where we never investigated anyone important deliberately we could hamstring Kira's actions, and I don't think the setup would not give him some kind of a backup if that were the case. We need to be on our toes about everyone.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

For it to be a purchase, there has to be a trade. In the context of this game, what can a Kira trade to get this "kill outside of the written rules" ability?

[Jeod]

Just now, Category 5 Hurricane said:

For it to be a purchase, there has to be a trade. In the context of this game, what can a Kira trade to get this "kill outside of the written rules" ability?

I would suggest proposal points or voting ability for X amount of days, but that would be obvious in the CVC. I think it makes the most sense that they would only be able to use the notebook every other night.

[OrangeP47]

Well, it's not outside of the written rules. He'd still get a name and a face. You have to think of these rules in very rules lawyery terms, and the rules have also even said there may be additional stipulations not revealed in the OP.

But having to make a trade for it is indeed a good point. I don't have an answer for that.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Jeod had an interesting answer to that, actually. I don't find it as viable though, but I can totally see such a game changing ability having a harsh penalty that you have to somehow live through. I just don't think that will turn out correct. I think Shinigami Eyes will be a passive ability that activates in docs, and can also be used actively instead of a killing action if required. So one person is probably known now.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Well, again, only if the Kira/Deathnote is already active, which it might not be.

[OrangeP47]

Being a closed setup is kind a problem, eh, heh. The proposal/trust/suspicion is already throwing everyone for a loop.

The big takeaway, though, and I think this is perfectly reasonable, is that I would not bet anything on investigations being the be all to end all of getting names to kill us.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Of course it isn't! You've been told the other two ways already!

[OrangeP47]

Well just from my PoV I appeared to be the only one remembering that for awhile there

[Jeod]

Biggest takeaway from today:

 

Blame Voe.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I'm baffled. I don't see how anyone has suggested that/

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Ok, I'm shutting the doors. I'm only allowing Nodlied, ChopBam, and myself to move. I'd actually lock myself too, if, I could.

##propose suspicion KillingYou 3

##propose suspicion Chaos_Knight 2

##propose suspicion FRAYDO 3

##propose suspicion Mojoman 3

##propose suspicion OrangeP47 3

[OrangeP47]

##propose suspicion Cat 5 5

I'll lock the door on you too, but not for the same reason

[Category 5 Hurricane]

Good, thanks.

[VERTi60]

 

 

[VERTi60]

2 minutes ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Ok, I'm shutting the doors. I'm only allowing Nodlied, ChopBam, and myself to move. I'd actually lock myself too, if, I could.

##propose suspicion KillingYou 3

##propose suspicion Chaos_Knight 2

##propose suspicion FRAYDO 3

##propose suspicion Mojoman 3

##propose suspicion OrangeP47 3

Category 5 Hurricane proposed 3 Suspicion Points to Killing You!
Category 5 Hurricane proposed 2 Suspicion Points to Chaos_Knight!
Category 5 Hurricane proposed 3 Suspicion Points to FRAYDO!
Category 5 Hurricane proposed 3 Suspicion Points to Mojoman!
Category 5 Hurricane proposed 3 Suspicion Points to OrangeP47!

 

1 minute ago, OrangeP47 said:

##propose suspicion Cat 5 5

I'll lock the door on you too, but not for the same reason

OrangeP47 proposed 5 Suspicion Points to Category 5 Hurricane!
 

 

[Jeod]

While we're waiting...

 

[VERTi60]

 

 Night 2 Voting Results:

 

You have decided that Category 5 Hurricane will be investigated tonight.

After thorough investigation, we have discovered that the suspect is no other than Light's girlfriend, the famous Misa Amane!

 

She's quite famous among young people as a public star, but her connection with Light might reveal some clues. We will apprehend her for tonight and keep her in the holding cell. In case she's the Kira,

 

We haven't found any clues on "Misa Misa", other than her Cell Phone. She likes to call Light from time to time it seems. If there are no other clues or evidence found, she's free to go next day.

 

 

 Confiscated Items & Arrested players:

 

Category 5 Hurricane as Misa Amane, the Kira Suspect  (holding cell, to be released)

Misa Amane's Cell Phone (unable to be used tonight by suspect, to be handed back next day) 

 

It is not possible to contact or pass items to Category 5 Hurricane tonight. 

Category 5 Hurricane is not able to perform night actions tonight.

 

Player that is chosen to be investigated will have his identity revealed, and held in a cell during the night, effectively blocking all the night actions and also confiscating all the items he/she had, including the Death Note. The Death Note is investigated and if the player is caught using it (doesn't matter when during the game), this player is eliminated as Kira. In case there is no other Kira the game will end, otherwise the game continues. If the person didn't used the Death Note he/she is released next day, but his Proposal points will be depleted until he/she will gain trust from somebody again.

 

 

 Night Rules:

 

During the NIGHT, you are able to use several Night actions at your disposal, or even combine them as you wish (if there is a restriction you will be told).

To use a Night Action, please Private Message Me during the Night Phase! Results will be posted before next day starts in next 24 hours!

Some of the actions include either item usage, special character abilities and actions that can be unlocked by having enough trust from the last day. Beware, most of these actions are one time use, if not stated differently.

This is also the time when the Death Note will be used. Only the current owner can access to interact with it. The Death Note itself can be passed to players too. Using the Death Note during the Night has some special rules to perform nightkills, which offer more possibilities and strategies. This is possible if the owner decides to interact with it. If Death Note is not used during the Night, it could be used during the day, but that action will be public. This can happen if the Death Note is passed during the Night.

 
Besides the night actions and Death Note usage, players will also be able to visit each other during the Night, and communicate in private in designated google docs.

Only Players that have gained more Trust than Suspicion can invite and accept other Players to doc communication. Players will be able to stay and discuss until one of them decides to leave. Please note that there are also risks visiting someone, so be aware who you accept to meet. You can only accept during the night, not next day.

Send me a PM if you want to meet someone (only one person): ##PROPOSE MEETING PLAYERNAME

The other person will receive a PM from me during the night, and also needs to accept it via PM (once again only one person if multiple players want to meet): ##ACCEPT MEETING PLAYERNAME

IF you propose or accept a meeting and you already are in a meeting, you will first have to leave the meeting. Use  ##LEAVE MEETING PLAYERNAME anytime in a PM, otherwise meeting docs will be available for two players until L decides otherwise. If any of the participants is interrogated, arrested or killed, the meeting will end automatically.

 
Night actions are done classic way by the Private Message only, same as resolved action replies. If you have a night action and do not inform me by PM in advance before the next Day phase begins (preferably asap, but not later than one hour before the game starts), you do nothing that night. If you know you'll do nothing anyway you can always tell me that too.
 
Forum Posting during the Night Phase is limited - 2 posts per player max. Players who won't comply will either receive a gimmick or gain 10 suspicion points for each extra post!

 

 

  Final CVC and Player Score Results:

 

 

The player with most trust is Chaos_Knight (94 Trust Points). He's able to use a special Night Action granted from L himself. Private Message will reveal details. Note that these actions can be different and can be combined with other night actions.

FRAYDO has missed the deadline to post, he's charged with 20 suspicion points!

 

During the day, a total of 439 Proposal Points were distributed to players. The next day, each player will receive a base of 88 Proposal Points (0.1*Day Number from the total number of distributed points).

Players who have gained Trust will also receive a Proposal Points bonus. Proposal Point Bonus is determined by the exact number of Trust points they've gained. 

If a player gained both Trust and Suspicion, by the start of the next day, the Suspicion points will be reduced by the exact number Trust points.

Note that there are also abilities that either cost proposal points or trust, and they can also increase Proposal Points, Suspicion and Trust to players so you can also expect different outcome next day. These will be calculated before proposal base and proposal bonus is applied.

 

[Jeod]

Verti writing the day end post: