Discuss Could you put this mod into the mods you guys create as a gamemode?

[Missingno50]

I want this to be in the game. (Ignore the bad footage, only footage I could find)

THIS IS MRPA2'S FOOTAGE! IF YOU DON'T WANT TO HEAR OF THEM EVER AGAIN DON'T LOOK.

The Life Of A GDI Engineer

The Glorious Life of a Harvester Crew

Edited February 25, 2017 by Missingno50

[Isaac The Madd]

http://www.moddb.com/mods/cc-assault

 

[Raap]

Are you asking if the modification of Renegade you posted two videos of, somehow was to be merged into APB or TSR?

Ignoring any ethical or design concerns, what you're asking is also very impractical. Anything used on Renegade is most likely not easily ported to APB/TSR due to client differences, so whatever it is you wish to copy over, you basically have to redo. With that said, adding a 'game mode' isn't possible, since W3D doesn't understand that concept. You have maps, and within those maps is the gameplay you design for it, which in most cases is very consistent by design. There is no 'flip the switch to change the gameplay' option, but you can have very different gameplay from one map to another, that is actually one of the strong points of the W3D engine (hey look I made a public positive comment about W3D!).

For example, when comparing my Hostile Waters map to other APB maps, you notice it is quite different in gameplay.

Edited February 25, 2017 by Raap

[Pushwall]

To speak for APB: When we left BHP I kind of promised the old staff that we're going to stop going crazy with feature-creep and completely overhauling the gameplay. Partly because we just don't have the team size to do it, partly because the game had been in development for over 13 years at that point, and partly because we're satisfied with what it is now. This seems like a pretty drastic change that would take an eternity to pull off with a questionable impact on the player base (how many of our players really want to spend the first half of a match grinding for buildings, not being able to fight, and yelling at each other if some newbie decides to drop the WF anywhere other than the optimal position of "rear of the base and facing towards the battlefield"?)

On top of that, as Siege has shown, forgoing VIS leads to horrible performance issues... buildings spawned midgame would be excluded from VIS and would be a big contributor to frame lag since they have so many meshes, so just put two and two together there. And how are the buildings with basements going to work with this?

[Raap]

2 minutes ago, Pushwall said:

To speak for APB: When we left BHP I kind of promised the old staff that we're going to stop going crazy with feature-creep and completely overhauling the gameplay.

On top of that, I'm not interested in doubling the length of matches and making players spend the first 30 minutes grinding for buildings, and as Siege has shown, forgoing VIS leads to horrible performance issues... buildings spawned midgame would be excluded from VIS and would be a big contributor to frame lag since they have so many meshes, so just put two and two together there.

In my opinion, base building has always been a gimmick that people requested "because it is part of the RTS games", not because it makes for fun gameplay in a shooter environment. APB's gameplay can be slow enough as it is, in certain situations. Slowing down gameplay even more just does not make any sense.

If someone wants a game where base building is part of it, then you need to design your game around it. For starters, the conceptual condition of victory only being achieved through base destruction in a scenario where bases are not finite, is akin to placing a finish line in front of you but attempting to reach it while running on a treadmill. Essentially, you're looking at a fundamental gameplay framework overhaul in order to make construction work... And I'm not convinced about the single most important factor in game development; Is the end goal even fun?

[MPRA2]

what....... why is this a thing? Did....... Did I inadvertently start something by playing the Commando mod?

[NoSoldier]

Yip. You fed the self acclaimed Master Lords of Kane with videos about that.

(If you've ever played ECW which indeed was at one point possible before on moddb the old w3d Engine is truly showing off some of it's capabilities.)

Gameplaywise as the others already stated this would need a complete revamp of some off the current mechanics. And the horrible horrible lag/framedrops (directx11 without VIS? Newer Graphics Cards get 7 FPS, I get 16).

I dunno but I always had the feeling that there was somewhat a memleak in the original engine but I'm no Techieguy.

 

Edited February 26, 2017 by NoSoldier

[NoSpoons]

In theory this sort of game could work very well, it's a very interesting concept if it's handled correctly and few have attempted it, but as it's been said above it wouldn't add much more to the game we currently know and love.

If you really are looking for this sort of game tho Check out a Game called Natural Selection 2, it's not exactly what you have in mind but you might enjoy it regardless.

[devilslayersbane]

The only game that really pulled off both RTS and FPS aspects was Battlezone 1998. This game and to a lesser extent, it's sequel BZII were absolutely golden games and my second experience to the FPS Genre. It still has a relatively small community playing it, but enough of one that the original game and it's expansion got a remaster from rebellion who now owns the rights to the franchise. This is one of the few true remasters, as the original game is almost completely untouched. Though, the aspects of the game that made it a bit quirky on modern OS's and resolutions (the 600x800 Max res for the main menu because it's actually a completely different shell) were changed to make it a bit less '98 and a bit more '09. And that's true for the graphics as well, as it uses a DX9 rendering engine now. That being said, I shouldn't be advertising the game. My point is, the renegade engine would need a ton of work to get base building in the mods, and then you're left with the balance issues that would cause, as matches could easily last 1-2 hours. Plus, one person would almost always be needed to harvest ore because there's only one AI truck per team. Not only that, but Battlezone works because the barren landscapes of space make it work. Earthy, vegetated environments make this much more difficult as the decision to build would be not only based on what you want but if you have room. The levels just aren't designed with this in mind.

A compromise could be made to where an AI brain determines what buildings to build. Or even more of a compromise, Infantry gameplay could be encouraged early game by scripts building each building as the maps play out. But then you still run into the problems with VIS.

Still, if you want a good game centered around shooting things and building a base, Battlezone 98 redux is only $20 on steam. It still looks a bit dated, and it's definitely got the 90's era clunky command menu, but it's well worth a play.

[OrangeP47]

Wasn't there a proposal, a loooong time ago, about base defenses (and only that) randomizing on certain maps? I'd weigh in on the size of the time and effort needed for all this is too great for the benefit, but just wondering if anyone else remembers that?

[Raap]

14 hours ago, OrangeP47 said:

Wasn't there a proposal, a loooong time ago, about base defenses (and only that) randomizing on certain maps? I'd weigh in on the size of the time and effort needed for all this is too great for the benefit, but just wondering if anyone else remembers that?

I don't know about all W3D projects, but @Pushwall is currently working on a system that makes defenses a bit less static for APB. It likely won't be random spawn locations since that is not a very elegant solution ("amagad why is this flametower there, shit gaeme i quit!").

Edit: User tagging doesn't work on this forum.

Edited February 28, 2017 by Raap

[Pushwall]

You were able to tag me here 

[Raap]

14 minutes ago, Pushwall said:

You were able to tag me here 

@Pushwall Hm, weird!

[OrangeP47]

Well, "simi-random", but same basic idea  heh.