S.O.S. IN NEED OF PLAYERS!

[Killing_You]

I still say that if we want to move to UE4, we should have some alternate ideas in mind for something we can sell. That's just my opinion.

[wolf]

 

But people like you just like to sit in their chair and do nothing while bragging about the old times, So you need an excuse.

My chair is pretty comfy to be fair, but I get your point. I'd like to do something on UE4, but I currently neither have the time or the team to do anything substantial with AR on a next-gen engine. Also there's the fact that I work on games for a living on top of AR, so sometimes I come home feeling pretty drained and not as willing to work on the projects.

 

There's a few factors that make this decision an incredibly tricky one for me personally.

 

 

So... just hand it over to someone who does have time? Get some fresh people on board to help you out. I have ported 80% of all Reborn assets to UDK. 30 mins of work a day / 1 month total.

Edited May 1, 2015 by wolf

[DeviousDave]

It would be better to release a playable version on the current engine first, I've seen far too many modders get over ambitious and switch to a new engine halfway through development and then lose interest due to the increased workload and expectations placed on them until they eventually fade away to nothing but a dusty memory in the annals of history.

 

Nothing kills a mod faster than people demanding and pestering the devs to do something they don't want to or placing immense amounts of pressure on them for an update.

 

I'd hate to see it happen again with AR (or TSR)

[Wallywood]

 

 

 

one word.

 

 

 

 

UDK.

 

 

 

 

/runs

UE4 would of made more sense... It's better.

 

Yes. It sure makes more sense to you. And i can tell you why. Cause Renegade X already released an SDK so there would be nothing stopping you from starting to dig into it. But people like you just like to sit in their chair and do nothing while bragging about the old times, So you need an excuse. And UE4 is the perfect excuse. That a port to UE4 would be much more work and that you have no starting point like Ren or RenX is perfect, cause you dont want things to change anyway.

 

 

Yup. That's why i've started working on my own Reborn port for UDK. Not having enough staff is no excuse... plenty of people out there interested in helping out.

The framework is there... the game art is there. The tools are easy as hell. The argument that UDK is "10 years old" is BS. It's still way better than anything W3D has to offer.

 

Actually...RenegadeX's SDK is perfect for a Renegade game. TSR isn't making a RenegadeX clone so it would be a lot more work to change whats up already there than to create our own. UDK is also already an outdated engine its like hooking up your mothers old Honda instead of getting a new one for free. Why make a game in an old engine when we can by pass it and go straight to the new one. Besides if the UE4 project fails, we can always fall back on UDK.

 

 

 

But people like you just like to sit in their chair and do nothing while bragging about the old times, So you need an excuse.

My chair is pretty comfy to be fair, but I get your point. I'd like to do something on UE4, but I currently neither have the time or the team to do anything substantial with AR on a next-gen engine. Also there's the fact that I work on games for a living on top of AR, so sometimes I come home feeling pretty drained and not as willing to work on the projects.

 

There's a few factors that make this decision an incredibly tricky one for me personally.

 

 

So... just hand it over to someone who does have time? Get some fresh people on board to help you out. I have ported 80% of all Reborn assets to UDK. 30 mins of work a day / 1 month total.

 

Uhhhh you don't have permission to use our assets for a TSR UDK stand alone game. Now if you're doing it all of fun-zies, then have fun.

[wolf]

mostly for funzies ;-) but i might release a playable build in case people really like it.

 

Ill make sure i get permission from the original creators.

Edited May 4, 2015 by wolf

[Wallywood]

mostly for funzies ;-) but i might release a playable in case people really like it.

 

Ill make sure i get permission from the original creators.

You would need our permission, as we are the owners of the game and its assets.

[wolf]

i don't want to go there again but:

 

TSR is nothing more than a gameplay / balance mod of the original CC: Reborn. I have as much right as you to use the assets.

 

Besides, what do you have to lose? I really don't understand the protectionism going on here.

 

I wouldn't even mind working together with W3Dhub on this.

[GeneralCamo]

Here are the problems:

1. We gained full rights to Reborn's assets and design
2. Even if we HADN'T, most of the old team is either with us, or they disappeared and can't be found anyway. (Only one I can think of that can still be found is Fobby, and he was just a sound designer AFAIK)
3. UDK is difficult to work with. UE4 is far more preferable (And as wallywood accidentely revealed, is a reality here)
4. You would share the spotlight with Renegade X.
5. The assets are severely outdated and would need to be updated beyond Diffuse. You would need to create Spec and Normals to even consider going to UDK now. This is a lot of work (that will be done if we ever go UDK). At least with UE4 (and Physically-Based Rendering) we would OWN the source code to the engine and be working in an experimental engine which has the capability to completely dominate the industry.

[Bayonetta]

You should release a bunch of assets though so people can mess around with them though on the UDK.

[Wallywood]

i don't want to go there again but:

 

TSR is nothing more than a gameplay / balance mod of the original CC: Reborn. I have as much right as you to use the assets.

 

Besides, what do you have to lose? I really don't understand the protectionism going on here.

 

I wouldn't even mind working together with W3Dhub on this.

You have that wrong, you we're thrown off the old team before I acquired the leadership role, thus you lost any right to the teams assets. When I was given control it was to ALL C&C Reborn assets. Also 90% of the team joined us in the new TSR project and helped push it out to the public. We didn't just mod a game that was released already, C&C Reborn BECAME Tiberian Sun Reborn.

 

What do we have to lose? Time... the amount of time that would need to be spent to re code the Renegade X SDK to get our assets in game properly with their proper features we could have written our own code in an engine that already has TONs of amazing features that are already in by default. Features that would have to be re coded to even have in the UDK engine. UE4 would put us ahead of the curve and not in the same (Why don't you guys upgrade engine's boat) in a few years.

 

Then why not do this the way I suggested to you on Teamspeak? You are choosing to try to take things apon your self (much like the actions that got you booted off the old team) in stead of working with the team. You do not have a right to those assets. I've offered you a way to help us out with a TSR future project but you can't seem to understand that a UDK TSR would be a waste of time and could just as well be a fall back project.

You should release a bunch of assets though so people can mess around with them though on the UDK.

We don't want a bunch of our assets floating around. Maybe after we update our assets to new engine standards we can do something like that. But its never a smart move to release your current assets to the public.

[Bayonetta]

 

i don't want to go there again but:

 

TSR is nothing more than a gameplay / balance mod of the original CC: Reborn. I have as much right as you to use the assets.

 

Besides, what do you have to lose? I really don't understand the protectionism going on here.

 

I wouldn't even mind working together with W3D Hub on this.

You have that wrong, you we're thrown off the old team before I acquired the leadership role, thus you lost any right to the teams assets. When I was given control it was to ALL C&C Reborn assets. Also 90% of the team joined us in the new TSR project and helped push it out to the public. We didn't just mod a game that was released already, C&C Reborn BECAME Tiberian Sun Reborn.

 

What do we have to lose? Time... the amount of time that would need to be spent to re code the Renegade X SDK to get our assets in game properly with their proper features we could have written our own code in an engine that already has TONs of amazing features that are already in by default. Features that would have to be re coded to even have in the UDK engine. UE4 would put us ahead of the curve and not in the same (Why don't you guys upgrade engine's boat) in a few years.

 

Then why not do this the way I suggested to you on Teamspeak? You are choosing to try to take things apon your self (much like the actions that got you booted off the old team) in stead of working with the team. You do not have a right to those assets. I've offered you a way to help us out with a TSR future project but you can't seem to understand that a UDK TSR would be a waste of time and could just as well be a fall back project.

You should release a bunch of assets though so people can mess around with them though on the UDK.

We don't want a bunch of our assets floating around. Maybe after we update our assets to new engine standards we can do something like that. But its never a smart move to release your current assets to the public.

 

 

Even if its one Wolverine? Heh, i never understood why people get so fussy over their creations. For me, if i make something i openly allow people to change it or use it. Because i know who originally made it anyway (Me

[Wallywood]

I'm going to openly state this....I know the public is excited about Renegade X showing off a few TSR assets in their last patch. I can also understand how this would spark an almost demand for a UDK TSR. But What the public isn't thinking about are the core issues with this idea. TSR has alot of units that have features that Renegade X never planned for. Underground units, Unit detection, Mechs, and Deploy-able vehicles are just a hand full of issues that we would be running into with the Renegade X SDK. One of the biggest issues that we currently have with the W3D engine is that everything has to be scripted in and a lot of what we want to do isn't possible because of that reason. With the Renegade X SDK we would have a lot of those same issues, on an already old engine. So why not spend the time coding our own code on a newer engine that other projects like AR, BFD, and other W3D Hub games can also benefit from? WE do have plans to upgrade engines and we know it's unrealistic to think that the W3D engine will last another 10 years or even be played. NOW please don't misunderstand what I'm saying, WE are not stopping work on the W3D engine, we will finish TSR W3D before adding TSR to a new engine and we would still support the TSR W3D. Also UDK isn't completely out of the question, we could very well have too many issues with a new engine and UDK could end up being the better choice. But wouldn't it be better to try to get TSR into an up to date engine, before settling for an older one. So I guess the real question here is "Would you rather have a brand new car for free ready to run straight off the showroom floor or get a used one that you have to repair and restore to even get it run?

[Bayonetta]

I'm going to openly state this....I know the public is excited about Renegade X showing off a few TSR assets in their last patch. I can also understand how this would spark an almost demand for a UDK TSR. But What the public isn't thinking about are the core issues with this idea. TSR has alot of units that have features that Renegade X never planned for. Underground units, Unit detection, Mechs, and Deploy-able vehicles are just a hand full of issues that we would be running into with the Renegade X SDK. One of the biggest issues that we currently have with the W3D engine is that everything has to be scripted in and a lot of what we want to do isn't possible because of that reason. With the Renegade X SDK we would have a lot of those same issues, on an already old engine. So why not spend the time coding our own code on a newer engine that other projects like AR, BFD, and other W3D Hub games can also benefit from? WE do have plans to upgrade engines and we know it's unrealistic to think that the W3D engine will last another 10 years or even be played. NOW please don't misunderstand what I'm saying, WE are not stopping work on the W3D engine, we will finish TSR W3D before adding TSR to a new engine and we would still support the TSR W3D. Also UDK isn't completely out of the question, we could very well have too many issues with a new engine and UDK could end up being the better choice. But wouldn't it be better to try to get TSR into an up to date engine, before settling for an older one. So I guess the real question here is "Would you rather have a brand new car for free ready to run straight off the showroom floor or get a used one that you have to repair and restore to even get it run?

 

Can't you make your own engine? that way you can code everything you need into it right from the get go?

[Omar007]

 

I'm going to openly state this....I know the public is excited about Renegade X showing off a few TSR assets in their last patch. I can also understand how this would spark an almost demand for a UDK TSR. But What the public isn't thinking about are the core issues with this idea. TSR has alot of units that have features that Renegade X never planned for. Underground units, Unit detection, Mechs, and Deploy-able vehicles are just a hand full of issues that we would be running into with the Renegade X SDK. One of the biggest issues that we currently have with the W3D engine is that everything has to be scripted in and a lot of what we want to do isn't possible because of that reason. With the Renegade X SDK we would have a lot of those same issues, on an already old engine. So why not spend the time coding our own code on a newer engine that other projects like AR, BFD, and other W3D Hub games can also benefit from? WE do have plans to upgrade engines and we know it's unrealistic to think that the W3D engine will last another 10 years or even be played. NOW please don't misunderstand what I'm saying, WE are not stopping work on the W3D engine, we will finish TSR W3D before adding TSR to a new engine and we would still support the TSR W3D. Also UDK isn't completely out of the question, we could very well have too many issues with a new engine and UDK could end up being the better choice. But wouldn't it be better to try to get TSR into an up to date engine, before settling for an older one. So I guess the real question here is "Would you rather have a brand new car for free ready to run straight off the showroom floor or get a used one that you have to repair and restore to even get it run?

 

Can't you make your own engine? that way you can code everything you need into it right from the get go?

 

 

While we probably could, it makes no sence to sink hours upon hours into something like that. It would involve creating a whole rendering, animation, shader, asset, etc pipeline in addition to just game logic as well.

You'd be better of taking an existing engine so you only need to take care of your game logic. Now that would only leave us (for C&C styled projects) with 2 choices; try to use the RenegadeX SDK that is build on an older engine version and doesn't properly fit the needed requirements, or use a brand new, blank slate and heavily customizable engine that you just need to build on top of and not hack together fixes to get the SDK to do what you want.

 

Seems to me the choice would be rather obvious in that case. Of course, I'd say that if the SDK does exactly what you want/need, it'd still be a valid option, even if the engine is a generation old.

[OWA]

You should release a bunch of assets though so people can mess around with them though on the UDK.

 

The assets technically have been released. Anyone can use XCC mixer to extract the models and play around with them.

[GeneralCamo]

It is perfectly acceptable to take our assets and use them as long as they are for personal use, as in not publicly distributed. If you want to publicly distribute them, you must ask us.

[wolf]

Just wait and see. You'll love it

Unreal script is no problem. I have several people working on TS specific functions. It's not that big of a deal.

 

I understand you dont want competition. And its not meant to be. It'll be an opensource release everyone can use, edit and modify to their hearts content. Even W3Dhub.

Edited May 8, 2015 by wolf

[Wallywood]

Just wait and see. You'll love it

Unreal script is no problem. I have several people working on TS specific functions. It's not that big of a deal.

 

I understand you dont want competition. And its not meant to be. It'll be an opensource release everyone can use, edit and modify to their hearts content. Even W3Dhub.

It has nothing to do with competition. It has everything to do with using TSRs property without permission. You don't seem to understand to point here, YOU do NOT have permission to release a mod using any of TSR's current assets. YOU DO have permission to make a mod for the public using your own assets.

[TeamWolf]

Some things never seem to change, how predicable.

[DeviousDave]

 

I understand you dont want competition. And its not meant to be. It'll be an opensource release everyone can use, edit and modify to their hearts content. Even W3D Hub.

 

 

You should probably ask W3d staff first, and by ask I mean plead, and by plead i mean offer to buy them all cakes with a cherry on top as well as a dozen boxes of doughnuts because so far it appears you have managed to irk WallyWood and no one irks WallyWood and lives (or at least gets his permission to use TS reborn stuff) and are probably going to upset Generalcamo and the rest of the devs too (never a good move... devs can be really vicious when they want to)

 

So try asking reeeeeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy nicely before posting any of mod publicly unless you want a cease and desist order.

 

 

 

Some things never seem to change, how predicable.

 

Pretty much sums up my day......

[wolf]

Alright. i'll keep things internal until we redo all of the game art. Even though some of the original creators have already agreed to me using their assets.

 

@Dave what's a C&D order going to do when they don't own the copyright? Not even the original creators do. All designs belong to EA, aside from the custom stuff. Wallywood is talking out of his ass.

Edited May 8, 2015 by wolf

[GeneralCamo]

Which original creators? Can you give me a list?

[Wallywood]

Alright. i'll keep things internal until we redo all of the game art. Even though some of the original creators have already agreed to me using their assets.

 

@Dave what's a C&D order going to do when they don't own the copyright? Not even the original creators do. All designs belong to EA, aside from the custom stuff. Wallywood is talking out of his ass.

Not sure how asking someone to not use our teams property is talking out of my ass but okay. Good luck with your mod, I'm sure it'll be fun having some healthy competition even though it's all going to become a big waste.

[wolf]

 

Alright. i'll keep things internal until we redo all of the game art. Even though some of the original creators have already agreed to me using their assets.

@Dave what's a C&D order going to do when they don't own the copyright? Not even the original creators do. All designs belong to EA, aside from the custom stuff. Wallywood is talking out of his ass.

 

Not sure how asking someone to not use our teams property is talking out of my ass but okay. Good luck with your mod, I'm sure it'll be fun having some healthy competition even though it's all going to become a big waste.

Thanks. I just don't like people claiming assets which they did not create as their own.

It's not your teams property and never will be.

 

Let's end this discussions here.

Edited May 8, 2015 by wolf

[Wallywood]

 

 

Alright. i'll keep things internal until we redo all of the game art. Even though some of the original creators have already agreed to me using their assets.

@Dave what's a C&D order going to do when they don't own the copyright? Not even the original creators do. All designs belong to EA, aside from the custom stuff. Wallywood is talking out of his ass.

Not sure how asking someone to not use our teams property is talking out of my ass but okay. Good luck with your mod, I'm sure it'll be fun having some healthy competition even though it's all going to become a big waste.

Thanks. I just don't like people claiming assets which they did not create as their own.

It's not your teams property and never will be.

 

Let's end this discussions here.

 

The C&C Reborn Team owns the assets right? This is something you have stated in the past right?

[wolf]

There's nothing stopping me from releasing the source files and you know it.

It's just that the assets are so outdated no one will give a shit about them

[Wallywood]

There's nothing stopping me from releasing the source files and you know it.

It's just that the assets are so outdated no one will give a shit about them

So thats how you want this to go down...damn and I had really thought you had grown up. I regret ever going to bat for you.

 

]Some things never seem to change, how predicable.

 

Teamwolf nailed this one right on the head.

[AndrewGOLD]

Well, this really ended like a bad TV show... I am agreed with WallyWood. We are going to lose a lot of valuable time moving from an engine to another. Assets should be kept in safe too.

[wolf]

Tell me. How is it any different from what happened to BHP and you guys just few months ago?

 

Something with a pot and a kettle... yeah.

 

 

There's nothing stopping me from releasing the source files and you know it.

It's just that the assets are so outdated no one will give a shit about them

So thats how you want this to go down...damn and I had really thought you had grown up. I regret ever going to bat for you.

]Some things never seem to change, how predicable.

 

Teamwolf nailed this one right on the head.

No i won't publish anything. I just want make it clear no one needs your or w3dhubs consent to use the assets as they do not belong to you. Edited May 9, 2015 by wolf

[Timeaua]

All I want are tech buldings, vehicle veterancy and stuff like that.