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OWA

W3D Hub Featured on Kotaku UK!

16 posts in this topic

This is awesome news! Hopefully this brings in more players.

 

6 minutes ago, OWA said:
  • It's Nod, not NOD (old joke is old)

ae8.png

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Good to see some outside exposure as always, but I really wish the author hadn't used that Arty shot for the only picture that features TSR out of all the shots we supplied. Oh well - next time then.

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Any publicity is good publicity. Although APB's activity has dramatically improved in the recent weeks, the server is more packed than empty now and I personally believe that is due to game and server visibility issues being resolved. Frequent patches also help.

Edited by Raap
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I think that the more external publicity there is the better. I have encountered folks who have had problems with the W3DHub Launcher and view its as "sketchy" or illegitimate. The more exposure there is about how this is a grass roots effort by fans to extend the life of a cult game will ensure the survival of these mods and Renegade. There needs to be even more tertiary exposure, you damn well know people would be better off playing this in their downtime in lieu of some mobile freemium game. I hope to see more of this in the future, because it enhances the legitimacy of these projects and informs the public that they are indeed going forward with EA's blessing.

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Just one comment, I do think referring to these projects as 'mods of renegade' is somewhat invalid. Mods are changes to gameplay based on the engine a game shipped with. W3D launched in 2002, but when you then apply 15 additional years of community driven engine development you start to reach a point where calling it a mod is discrediting to the work of the programming team. 

Then there is the fact that during BHP days, EA actually gave full permission to allow these projects to be marketed as independent games (providing no profit is generated due to using the C&C IP), and even outright gave the W3D source assets they still had - the full source code was lost, not even EA has it. But according to Jonwil, everything but the AI pathfind generation has been reverse engineered and updated, with this last thing being quite complicated. So essentially, the community has code in their hands that EA does not, top that off with an incredible number of code changes over the years, and you're more looking at a W3D 2.0 than the W3D that shipped in 2002.

The vast majority of true modifications offer no engine improvements due to various reasons. You can look at a mod for C&C Generals and recognising it as a C&C Generals mod. If you compare Renegade to for example, APB, you'd not see the comparison, and the few connections you do see - victory by base destruction - is actually there by design due to both games being C&C inspired shooters (to further add to my point; APB features gameplay not native to the 2002 W3D engine in various levels).

Edited by Raap
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  WHAT IF LIKE MAYBE 1,000 PLAYERS JOIN w3dhub  the servers would be full nd many servers would have to be created but would w3dhub get money and get more technology and upgrades and speed the production of the games and the release of them like take for instance  AR it's NOT fully developed yet but it's almost done like maybe half or maybe more if it will be released in July this year then we will be happy i not than maybe december if not that than its it 2020 will be the release

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2 hours ago, thedisclaimitory said:

rabble rabble rabble rabble rabble rabbleh rabblueah babblah rabbluah rabbleh rabble rabble rabble

W3DHub cannot accept revenue from the games provided.

However to host services like game servers, donations are accepted.

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3 hours ago, thedisclaimitory said:

  WHAT IF LIKE MAYBE 1,000 PLAYERS JOIN w3dhub  the servers would be full nd many servers would have to be created but would w3dhub get money and get more technology and upgrades and speed the production of the games and the release of them like take for instance  AR it's NOT fully developed yet but it's almost done like maybe half or maybe more if it will be released in July this year then we will be happy i not than maybe december if not that than its it 2020 will be the release

z5zeAPT.jpg

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23 hours ago, Raap said:

Just one comment, I do think referring to these projects as 'mods of renegade' is somewhat invalid. Mods are changes to gameplay based on the engine a game shipped with. W3D launched in 2002, but when you then apply 15 additional years of community driven engine development you start to reach a point where calling it a mod is discrediting to the work of the programming team. 

Then there is the fact that during BHP days, EA actually gave full permission to allow these projects to be marketed as independent games (providing no profit is generated due to using the C&C IP), and even outright gave the W3D source assets they still had - the full source code was lost, not even EA has it. But according to Jonwil, everything but the AI pathfind generation has been reverse engineered and updated, with this last thing being quite complicated. So essentially, the community has code in their hands that EA does not, top that off with an incredible number of code changes over the years, and you're more looking at a W3D 2.0 than the W3D that shipped in 2002.

The vast majority of true modifications offer no engine improvements due to various reasons. You can look at a mod for C&C Generals and recognising it as a C&C Generals mod. If you compare Renegade to for example, APB, you'd not see the comparison, and the few connections you do see - victory by base destruction - is actually there by design due to both games being C&C inspired shooters (to further add to my point; APB features gameplay not native to the 2002 W3D engine in various levels).

I think that marketing our projects as independent games, (whilst EA said we could release them as standalones) is a risky move due to the legal implications. By saying that our projects are Renegade mods, it instantly sets it apart from your average free-to-play games that may or may not have monetisation. With a mod you always know it's going to be free, which at first glance is good at getting our message across that we are free forever.

I think that the best way to describe the projects would be standalone total-conversion mods. We started with a game, Renegade, and built off of that; so I think that classification fits us well without stepping into the murky waters of indie, free-to-play and freemium games.

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1 hour ago, OWA said:

I think that marketing our projects as independent games, (whilst EA said we could release them as standalones) is a risky move due to the legal implications. By saying that our projects are Renegade mods, it instantly sets it apart from your average free-to-play games that may or may not have monetisation. With a mod you always know it's going to be free, which at first glance is good at getting our message across that we are free forever.

I think that the best way to describe the projects would be standalone total-conversion mods. We started with a game, Renegade, and built off of that; so I think that classification fits us well without stepping into the murky waters of indie, free-to-play and freemium games.

You'd just be limiting the appeal. Many players don't bother with mods, and the word 'mod' comes with the notion that a game is required to run them - "stand-alone mod" is a term nobody really heard of before and is easily overlooked.

During BHP days EA gave the go-ahead towards doing whatever with the sole condition that no profit was generated. But your concerns aren't totally misplaced, since those loose agreement were with BHP and a C&C development team, two parties that no longer exist. Nothing was ever agreed with on paper and all it could take is one ill-informed EA legal employee to do what EA remains infamous for.

That being said, consider reaching out to EA at one point to try and clear things up?

Lastly, my post mainly focused on the fairness of the mod classification being somewhat discrediting to all the code reworks on the engine over the years. W3D projects are no more or less 'mods' than any games based on, for example, the unreal engine. Both W3D games and those games use modified engines that were not created from scratch in-house, the only difference is the paperwork (aka, money was paid). From purely a development perspective there is no differentiation to be made.

Edited by Raap

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Just be like 'Hey EA can we pay you 10 bucks for the licence to this 15 year old engine?' They'd probably be up for it..

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If EA joined w3dhub I would say hell no why because they destroyed command and conquer and after they have finished with joining us they would say ha ha we take over your company and we destory command and conquer and we finished it  so bye bye wedhub or w3dhub

Edited by thedisclaimitory
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Great article, it was how I found APB (beta) back in the day in gameinformer (I think)

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