[GAME OVER- ATREIDES VICTORY] Battle for Dune Mafia 1

[Category 5 Hurricane]

That isn't what I did. I swapped Louis and Shade. Louis must have picked FRAYDO on her own accord.

[ChopBam]

Just now, Category 5 Hurricane said:

That isn't what I did. I swapped Louis and Shade. Louis must have picked FRAYDO on her own accord.

The only case where I can see Louis jailing FRAYDO intentionally is if she considered him a scum suspect or suspected him to be the target last night. Being that she suspected you and not FRAYDO, and that FRAYDO is not a power role to be targeted by a NK, do you see any precedent for her to target FRAYDO?

And if you swapped Louis and Shade, why didn't Shade get jailed instead? It sounds like it should be pretty simple, but am I misunderstanding how this works?

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I can only guess, but remember Shade was trying to warn Louis that she had to "catch" me by finding out who I was going to swap myself with, and block me. Which is a logical contradiction for the reasons I already mentioned. The fact that I can swap people around is only a theoretical threat if I can both swap and kill at the same time. The item suspected to counter Louis's role was in Jeod possession. Also assumes I can target myself, which isn't allowed.

Her night post suggests to me she took Shade's ideas to heart and decided to try to figure out who my swap target would be.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I swapped Louis and Shade, meaning actions targeting Louis landed on Shade, and actions targeting Shade landed on Louis. This would not impact Louis using her own role at all. It does mean that the NK was actually targeting Shade, but since I said I could prove my role by swapping Louis and Shade, Shade could have caught this and targeted himself.

[ChopBam]

Shade is known to say a lot of things that make little to zero sense, as town or scum. Being our resident AUM, this makes him the easiest scapegoat ever for scum. Picking out the stuff he says is almost like a free ride.

While this bit may be somewhat trivial, I figured I would include it since it sticks out to me. It's the exact same role that I have, and from the description Shade has made of it, I share his description of it as well. One could say "Shade knows the Dune flavor" but KY's game could have any set amount of roles that do any number of things, and I don't think it's a coincidence that Shade's roleclaim and description are very close to my own.

On 5/10/2022 at 10:36 AM, Shade939 said:

Light Infantry.

Now, onto the things you have been saying @ Category 5 Hurricane . Let's break down these implications a bit.

You point out all the contradictory things Shade is saying, and mentioning slipping out too much information about what items are in play, and more. But in the middle of all this easy scum Shade slippage, you suggest he has a moment of extreme clarity and luck, and can fool both Louis and you (even after fishing for more information about your role, to which you responded with a pink tractor in order to keep that information from him), ending up using reverse psychology successfully to target himself for a night kill and to get our jailor killed. Calling this far-fetched is putting it lightly.

Combine with this the fact that Shade and Jeod were fighting tooth and nail in this thread to try to get each other voted, and you suggest to us with a straight face that they were on a scum team together. This could have been some serious big brain on their part, but knowing what I know about both Jeod and Shade, I don't think they would invent, organize, and then execute something like such a complicated matrix of in-fighting so early when there was absolutely no need to.

This war between Shade and Jeod wasn't composed of a few half-hearted tit-for-tats that we occasionally see between scum when they are afraid one may get lynched so the other distances themself for town. This seems to have started at the beginning of D2 when Shade started pretending he knew something, and Jeod said he was going to shoot shade, and it only became more serious from there, right up until the time Jeod was voted off.

I'll also point out the sussing and discussion between them was a great deal of interaction that could have simply taken place in the scum doc if they were together. What follows for the rest of this post is an abridged summary of the fighting between the two. I'll note again this started at the beginning of D2 when there was no reason for two scum members to fight.

On 5/9/2022 at 4:08 PM, Jeod said:

Would you like me to shoot you now, or wait until you get home?

 

On 5/9/2022 at 4:49 PM, Shade939 said:

He could be Mafia with a day kill.

 

On 5/9/2022 at 5:32 PM, Shade939 said:

Let me guess, you roleblocked Jeod...

 

On 5/9/2022 at 5:44 PM, Shade939 said:

I can tell you the odds, but sometimes Town really does get that lucky.

 

On 5/9/2022 at 5:58 PM, Shade939 said:

I'm really only thinking it's you because Louis seemed to have targeted you with an ability that makes you a suspect of the failed NK. If it's not because of her ability, then it should obviously be someone else's ability instead and a different player.

 

On 5/9/2022 at 6:39 PM, Shade939 said:

Welp, I know what to do now then.

##Vote Jeod

 

On 5/9/2022 at 9:07 PM, Shade939 said:

On 5/9/2022 at 9:04 PM, ChopBam said:

To try, and fail, to get himself out of the spotlight.

On that I completely agree.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 4:01 AM, Jeod said:

I'm always in the spotlight. So much in fact it seems Shade got jealous of it and wanted to be on the other side of it. Unfortunately I don't have time to catch up properly because I've gotta get to work (longer commute now), but I will say that my role and action last night are both fairly simple and given the way Shade is controlling the day and making "predictions" I'm starting to wonder if he deliberately chose a no-kill.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 6:34 AM, Jeod said:

@ Shade939  What did you do last night? Are you still going to claim vanilla even after suggesting you affect those who visit you?

 

On 5/10/2022 at 8:47 AM, Shade939 said:

Why yes, for you it would be, because you'd be a mafia item thief.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 8:53 AM, Jeod said:

You just keep on telling yourself I’m scum no matter what. I’m curious about this double-roleblocker thing going on, but haven’t been able to read through it at my own pace yet.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 10:32 AM, Shade939 said:

I'm convinced it's Chopbam and Jeod.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 10:44 AM, Jeod said:

Or a scum cat5 and scum shade with a failed night kill on me.

 

On 5/9/2022 at 7:14 PM, Shade939 said:

@ Louis , so what made you decide to target Jeod and basically win the entire game?

 

On 5/10/2022 at 2:54 PM, Jeod said:

Shade is still my #1 scum suspect. Everything in my perspective of events leads to him over the other vanilla claims.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 3:07 PM, Jeod said:

That said, now that my point of view is fully on the table:

##vote Shade939

 

On 5/10/2022 at 5:31 PM, Shade939 said:

So, is anyone else going to vote Jeod?

 

On 5/10/2022 at 5:54 PM, Jeod said:

Because I'm the only one who scumreads you at the moment and am the safe mislynch?

 

On 5/10/2022 at 5:55 PM, Jeod said:

You even tried manipulating Louis with the jailer vs roleblocker thing to your benefit.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 5:55 PM, Shade939 said:

I mean, the fact that you're voting for me despite everything that's going on kind of speaks for itself...

 

On 5/10/2022 at 8:54 PM, Shade939 said:

The reasonable question I would ask, is who can be partnered with Jeod?

Asking who could be partnered with Irish doesn't really have as many possibilities.

 

On 5/10/2022 at 9:49 PM, Shade939 said:

Well, I'm as convinced of Jeod being mafia as I can really get. 

 

On 5/11/2022 at 4:39 AM, Jeod said:

I find it hard to believe there are two jailers in the setup at this point. I'm going to go through the thread again today and collectively summarize what narrowed me down to Shade being scum, as well as why TheIrishMan is probably his partner.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 5:36 AM, Jeod said:

[long post about how Shade is scum]

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:17 AM, Jeod said:

Read my post more thoroughly, I have my item. Shade wants a BP item to exist since it’ll explain away his troubles.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:18 AM, Shade939 said:

Neither, pointing out what defensive item I should have if I had one.

By the way, want to see another inconsistency in Jeod's claims, that he can trade items with players and is a smuggler...

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:31 AM, Shade939 said:

Also, what's up with you're laser focus on me having a passive ability to role block players @ Jeod ?

We literally have Louis claiming a role blocker who targeted you and Category 5 has the ability to influence other players actions, and you're response is Shade must have role blocked me after I tried to pass an item to him that disappeared, if anything I'd assume you're trying to cover up that you used an item and visited me last night.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:41 AM, Jeod said:

So you're saying I wasn't jailed now? Is that what you're saying?

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:44 AM, Shade939 said:

Do you have a problem with that, because you really aren't paying attention if you think I'm the one who said that couldn't have happened?

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:51 AM, Jeod said:

Feel free to outline your entire version of events so that I may poke several holes in it like the Swiss cheese it is.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 9:55 AM, Shade939 said:

1. No NK happened.

2. Louis targeted you to roleblock you, her action was used.

3. Category 5, later claims that he swapped the roleblock targets, so Irish was role blocked instead.

4. You have a very convoluted story about your role and what you did.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 10:16 AM, Shade939 said:

Because you really are scum, if you weren't you would have accused Category 5 a long time ago.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 12:38 PM, Shade939 said:

Hey @ Jeod , I think I found the item you tried to pass me last night?

 

On 5/11/2022 at 1:46 PM, Shade939 said:

Proper alignment should be House Atreides instead.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 2:27 PM, Jeod said:

I'm not mad at being voted, I'm upset that I've wasted a good part of my day playing with shade the punching bag and participating. If nobody else is going to have time for it, what's the point in putting forth the effort.

 

On 5/11/2022 at 2:36 PM, Shade939 said:

How many of your contributions haven't been directed at calling me scum?

 

On 5/11/2022 at 2:55 PM, Shade939 said:

From another point of view @ Jeod , we know you're Scum, and your arguments to convince us otherwise have all failed and actually convinced us even more that we should vote you up.

As much as you might try to convince us with effort, you do need to put forth better arguments, rather than trying to goad other players into distracting Town from you.

 

[Jeod]

On 5/11/2022 at 4:57 PM, Shade939 said:

Do you really believe your own hype that much?

 

On 5/11/2022 at 4:58 PM, Jeod said:

I am the hype!

 

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I can make quote trees of the interactions between two players, too!

On 5/7/2022 at 11:18 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I'm confused. Wasn't your question in response to what he labeled you? Why are you speculating on your own alignment? Did I miss something?

On 5/8/2022 at 3:42 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I agree, but I'd like to hear why you think so in more detail.

On 5/8/2022 at 5:00 PM, Jeod said:

I cast your assertion aside as a typical excitement of yours, which is why you're not being voted at the moment. I'm certainly taking note that two individuals of the seven seem to have a problem with it.

On 5/9/2022 at 1:58 AM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

It's true, and I feel like whenever we have a long break like this, it's easier to forget what you "aren't supposed to do" when given that question. As much as even I acknowledge the "MU Rule" as a joke, I keep it in mind.

I still feel kind of off regarding the TP/Neutrals being brought up. Thinking about TP/Neutrals at this stage of the game is scum-leaning in my book. But now I feel like I might have misunderstood the discussion due to not knowing the source material and might be tunneling a bit, so whatever. I'll give it a pass, for now.

We'll see what we think in the morning.

On 5/10/2022 at 4:07 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Incorrect.

What the fuck? No you were not. If that is true, that is fucking ridiculous.

On 5/10/2022 at 4:27 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

That's because Jeod suddenly claiming he was jailed does not fit what I think happened, and it makes me rather annoyed that I have to consider if it's actually true.

On 5/10/2022 at 4:42 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Louis actually jailed TheIrishman. I don't believe this claim that Jeod was also jailed. I think this is something else.

On 5/10/2022 at 4:44 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Which one? The one about you being scum? That could very well still be correct.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:17 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I don't know what the hell is going on with Jeod. I think he's suspect #2, because what he is saying does not match up.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:26 PM, Jeod said:

@ Category 5 Hurricane  Who we’re your bus targets again?

On 5/10/2022 at 6:28 PM, Jeod said:

Never mind it was me and Irish. So in the end I still ended up visiting shade.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:35 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Wanna tell me how you worked that out?

On 5/10/2022 at 6:39 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Absolutely could be.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:42 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

This is why you don't just set all your cards down on the table right away, folks.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:43 PM, Jeod said:

I don’t follow.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:44 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

There are other explanations for me knowing Louis jailed Irish than me bussing.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:47 PM, Jeod said:

It’s called putting the pieces together and logically filling in the blanks.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:51 PM, Jeod said:

 

 

 

 

Here, try it for yourself. It's quite cool.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:56 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Based on what I have said, I could have tracked Louis to TheIrishman, or watched TheIrishman and saw Louis visit.

On 5/10/2022 at 6:59 PM, Jeod said:

Could have, but then why would you feel the need to say you don't believe I was also jailed? The natural and logical conclusion is a bus driver.

On 5/10/2022 at 8:02 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I agree, it's an excellent case. Jeod's hiding something and has changed his story to adapt to what we know.

But I think the case works better assuming that Jeod was slowly revealing he was jailed/blocked. But unless there is a second unclaimed jailor/blocker, he wasn't. After a night where there was no kill, why admit to being blocked? I don't understand what Jeod is doing.

I know why TheIrishman admitted to it, I pushed him to do so. He probably wouldn't have otherwise.

On 5/10/2022 at 8:07 PM, Jeod said:

I spent the night in a cell. Matches up with what Louis said. I still don't know what you do if you're not a bus driver, but unless Louis' ability was duplicated somehow then there must be a second.

On 5/11/2022 at 5:54 AM, Jeod said:

@ Category 5 Hurricane I’m surprised how easily you accepted that block of text.

On 5/11/2022 at 4:21 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Yeah, I'm not convinced. 

This has to be a short post as I'm at work, but Jeod's story doesn't make sense to me. I still think he is lying about something, but I don't understand why he's using the story he has. I guess we'll have to check TheIrishman after this.

##vote Jeod

On 5/11/2022 at 4:22 PM, Jeod said:

No point in hosting or playing mafia games anymore I see.

Though I admit most of the suspicion was coming from me to Jeod and not back to me, but perhaps Jeod didn't think he could go toe to toe with me. For my part, Jeod slipping that he knew me to be a bus driver before I gave enough information to confirm that was key to me eventually voting him. I understand that at the time I was more suspicious of TheIrishman than Jeod, but I knew TheIrishman was jailed on a night a NK didn't happen. Kind of natural to think that's worth suspicion, and was independent of Jeod either way.

 

I'm also going to point out that this game should already be locked up. Shade and myself seem to be the only plausible scum members now, so you just need to lynch one and then if that is wrong, lynch the other. Perhaps Shade already figured this out, given that he seems to have stopped playing.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

7 hours ago, ChopBam said:

While this bit may be somewhat trivial, I figured I would include it since it sticks out to me. It's the exact same role that I have, and from the description Shade has made of it, I share his description of it as well. One could say "Shade knows the Dune flavor" but KY's game could have any set amount of roles that do any number of things, and I don't think it's a coincidence that Shade's roleclaim and description are very close to my own.

Would a vanilla scum not have the same role name?

[Retaliation]

4 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Would a vanilla scum not have the same role name?

Yes, this is why I didn't publicly respond to the attempt to prove himself town.

Also it's just a jerk move.

[Retaliation]

I'm doing this now ao I don't forget.

##vote cat5

Between shade and cat5 i feel like cat5 has been giving me vibes similar to godzilla mafia where he embellishes his role to sound town. I also don't trust his post about not realizing he gave something away when he's been cagey about his role all game.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

I got a little carried away when I realized I could corner Shade with that, assuming Louis followed my case and that Shade would be killing Louis. Louis would jail herself, no kill would happen, and Louis would be able to verify it all. I thought it was a good way to tightly wrap up my case on him, having established that the only thing he's worried about are my swap targets, not that I was going to make a kill, and looked to me that he was trying to make sure Louis didn't look his way. I didn't consider at all that it would be possible to target himself, but realized after that while a bus driver isn't allowed to target themselves (because that would make them almost impossible to target) there is no established rule that a mafia player can't target themselves.

But choosing to lynch me now is fine, probably optimal just to get me out of the way just to verify myself. Just need to get Shade after, and we're done.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

There was also a little bit of hedging on my part, hoping that because I said that out loud, Shade would think I actually wouldn't do that.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

But I suppose from Shade's point of view, it was a no risk situation. By now we know that Jeod failed to kill because he was swapped back to himself on N1. In the scenario that Shade looks like he might get swapped, if he targets himself it works out either way. If the swap happens, he kills Louis. If it doesn't, there is no kill, and he can blame that on me hopefully being blocked like he wanted.

[ChopBam]

9 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I can make quote trees of the interactions between two players, too!

On 5/7/2022 at 9:18 PM, Category 5 Hurricane said:

You responded with a quote tree of your own, but it kinda misses the point. I wasn't saying quote trees by themselves make a strong case. It was the the content and context of the quote tree that was relevant. They had heavy-hitting stuff on each other right out of the gate on D2 and lasted all day. I don't think Jeod or Shade would fake this. They don't have the personality or the brazenness. And Jeod wouldn't complain about how he wasted so much time trading blows with Shade and making cases against him if it was all meant to be a ruse anyway.

16 hours ago, ChopBam said:

This war between Shade and Jeod wasn't composed of a few half-hearted tit-for-tats that we occasionally see between scum when they are afraid one may get lynched so the other distances themself for town.

Your and Jeod's exchange, on the other hand, actually fits the bill way better, so thank you for saving me the work of posting that quote tree. I think it actually follows a bit what I said about how scum tend to sus each other out with varying degrees of softness when the circumstance calls for it, something which does not apply to Jeod/Shade.

I've noted that you didn't respond to this section of my post at all. You responded to the Light Infantry thing, and made some jape about quote trees, but nothing responding to what I said about how outlandish it would be for Our AUM Shade, SHADE, (SHADE???), in a brief move of blazing brilliance, to choose tails over heads and target himself for a nightkill in order to successfully kill Louis through your unwitting actions (???), and simultaneously fool Louis into jailing FRAYDO for some reason ().

More Notes

• Cat5 took forever to admit he was a bus driver. He was happy to suggest and to leave us guessing that he could be a role blocker or watcher (town looks more favorably on RB/watchers than bussing roles), but Jeod suggested the bus thing for Cat5 early on. A slip? Not sure. This part honestly confused me a bit. Cat5 eventually admitted to being a bus driver after having it called out and being an unavoidable thing, but wouldn't elaborate at all to any of us about its limitations or how it works. Posted pink tractors, and even now when he's "okay with being voted," he's still holding this close to the chest for some reason, as if (in the case of him dying and flipping town), it helps town somehow to still have this information left unknown. I'll note that I have seen no evidence at all of these secrets being helpful to town. He certainly suggests that they weren't a help last night (or forgot about that part of his story, I don't know).
• Cat5 has said multiple times he is okay getting voted. This also confuses me a bit, but could pass as a gamble of nonchalance.
  • "With very little left to lose, if I express that I don't mind being voted in order to clear the air, maybe they'll vote for the other guy."
• Cat5 did what I thought was a lot of really good sleuth work throughout the first part of this game, with a post count typical of his play style when he's town. Up to this point though I've sort of ignored the fact that he pushed hard for Irish as #1 scum suspect ahead of Jeod, when in reality Jeod was scum and Irish was town. Was okay calling Jeod scum #2, but only after a day of heavy pressure from most players against Jeod. Cat5, our quote trees are as different as night and day, Mr. "I was on board with lynching real scum, see I voted for Jeod 40 minutes before hammer after his fate was basically sealed already at 4v3".
• Cat5 didn't express surprise, remorse, or any other evidence of a changed disposition at Irish flipping town the following day, despite prioritizing him ahead of Jeod most of Day 2.
• A big 🚩🚩🚩 for me at the start of this Day was when Cat5 opened right out of the gate with guns blazing with something about how Shade outfoxed him at the last and then came in hot with this story about how Shade attempted a suicidal nightkill. Could be legit in way I guess maybe if you squint? But to me and to all the rest of the seven hells, this bell rings a much stronger toll as attempted narrative control.

Yes I am aware, in a great stroke of unluck, I suppose a town player could look as sussy as this too. To varying degrees the stars have aligned just wrong for me before. But I don't know man, at some point I gotta look at it and combine it with the rest of the case information we have, and in my book if we eliminate the assumptions and what appears as most likely to be really strange mental gymnastics regarding Shade, this snowball has rolled down the hill too far and become too large to stop.

##vote Category 5

@ Shade939  You said you were gonna come back to at least cast a vote today?

@ FRAYDO Got thoughts?

[ChopBam]

On 5/15/2022 at 5:17 PM, FRAYDO said:

@ Louis

This wouldn't be a true Mafia game if you weren't jailed by RNG. Lord for the sake of all that is memes please let it have been RNG. 

[ChopBam]

6 hours ago, Retaliation said:

Yes, this is why I didn't publicly respond to the attempt to prove himself town.

Also it's just a jerk move.

I feel like I missed something.. maybe I'll ask after the game what caused the penalty vote because I'm a bit confused.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

1 hour ago, ChopBam said:

I've noted that you didn't respond to this section of my post at all. You responded to the Light Infantry thing, and made some jape about quote trees, but nothing responding to what I said about how outlandish it would be for Our AUM Shade, SHADE, (SHADE???), in a brief move of blazing brilliance, to choose tails over heads and target himself for a nightkill in order to successfully kill Louis through your unwitting actions (???), and simultaneously fool Louis into jailing FRAYDO for some reason ().

The explanation for this was literally just above your post. I understand it wasn't in direct response to you, but you'll notice is does answer your question.

6 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

But I suppose from Shade's point of view, it was a no risk situation. By now we know that Jeod failed to kill because he was swapped back to himself on N1. In the scenario that Shade looks like he might get swapped, if he targets himself it works out either way. If the swap happens, he kills Louis. If it doesn't, there is no kill, and he can blame that on me hopefully being blocked like he wanted.

And Louis jailing FRAYDO has nothing to do with this. And to accept that I did have something to do with this means that you think I can swap players and NK at the same time.

And this whole thing about me needing to role claim is bunk. I have nothing left to claim. There aren't extra bits I'm hiding about my role. Frankly the deception here is that I was keeping quiet to make it appear there might be something else, but outside the number of times I can swap players, there just isn't. Shade figured out what I was hiding anyway, with the every-other-phase limitation.

And lastly, why should I have any remorse over TheIrishman? I didn't vote for him, and in doing so I left myself in a tie with him. It isn't my fault he is dead.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

2 hours ago, ChopBam said:

• Cat5 did what I thought was a lot of really good sleuth work throughout the first part of this game, with a post count typical of his play style when he's town. Up to this point though I've sort of ignored the fact that he pushed hard for Irish as #1 scum suspect ahead of Jeod, when in reality Jeod was scum and Irish was town. Was okay calling Jeod scum #2, but only after a day of heavy pressure from most players against Jeod. Cat5, our quote trees are as different as night and day, Mr. "I was on board with lynching real scum, see I voted for Jeod 40 minutes before hammer after his fate was basically sealed already at 4v3".

Actually not lastly, I have problems with this, too. You can go ahead and debate vote timing all you like, and this argument can be used well. But the thing left out is that voting happens when a player is available. There was a several hour window when I was not online because I was sleeping, and then going to work. To focus on the "40 minutes before hammer" bullshit because of coincidental circumstances is not a good argument, especially when a known town player in TheIrishman voted at the same time, for the same reasons.

[Category 5 Hurricane]

The rest of it, fine. Can't blame you for any of the rest of that. It's why I don't care if you vote me now or not. Because the absolute worst case scenario is, we've all got it wrong and it's neither me nor Shade, and if that happens and I'm in LYLO, I'm getting voted out and we lose.

[FRAYDO]

I've been thinking a bit before coming back to this thread. I almost convinced myself that Shade could be scum in this game, but that would have to be a carefully planned bus from a Scum Doc and as good as Jeod and Shade are as players, I cannot see them cooperating to this extent. Adding to that thought, I believe Shade's vanilla claim and as such, he would have been the more viable fall if such a plan was ever set.

Given Irish's reveal, it's without doubt that ChopBam is Town. Retaliation was also determined to be Town when he was locked up yet there was still an attempt on Louis' life, although I was doubting his vanilla claim. I have seen no indication to believe otherwise, so this does indeed add another thumb-twiddler to the pool. And if I still maintain that Shade is vanilla, that leaves the one surviving power role player to be Category 5, our remaining scum.

I admit that ultimately, this decision was largely influenced by choosing the player who has claimed abilities and actions over those of us who have done largely nothing these nights save for being jailed.

##vote Category 5 Hurricane

4 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

And Louis jailing FRAYDO has nothing to do with this. And to accept that I did have something to do with this means that you think I can swap players and NK at the same time.

I'll cherry-pick this statement and note that we can't verify the swap at all, given that it seems the majority of us are vanilla and thus cannot have done anything anyway to be inconvenienced by a bus. It's likely Louis did choose me after all given her earlier indication of doing so.

On 5/13/2022 at 7:01 AM, Louis said:

Shade said it correctly, I wanted to choose the most unexpected people, originally it was going to be FRAYDO, but I changed my mind to Retal because I haven't really heard from him. I knew there was going to be an attempt on my life so I use my item. In that way knowing I was attacked, Retal is clear to me.

Additionally,

On 5/12/2022 at 8:30 PM, Louis said:

The only people i can see not off the scum list is you or FRAYDO

'course, I'm not trying to turn this around on me! Just clarifying Louis' intentions as I believe they were.

In case it was missed within this text, restating the vote

##vote Category 5 Hurricane

 

[ChopBam]

With that being explained, I could see Louis jailing FRAYDO intentionally I suppose. With items such as killer drones in play (and who knows what else), I was able to see a swap and a kill happening from the same person in the same night.

12 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

There was also a little bit of hedging on my part, hoping that because I said that out loud, Shade would think I actually wouldn't do that.

5 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

I have nothing left to claim

Very well.

5 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

And lastly, why should I have any remorse over TheIrishman? I didn't vote for him, and in doing so I left myself in a tie with him. It isn't my fault he is dead.

You made a big case about it on D2. Town did the rest of the work after lynching Jeod, but you definitely played a big role in swaying them to that point of view. Beyond this, it was strange to me that he went from being suspect #1 in your book to just completely falling off your scumdar.

5 hours ago, Category 5 Hurricane said:

Actually not lastly, I have problems with this, too. You can go ahead and debate vote timing all you like, and this argument can be used well. But the thing left out is that voting happens when a player is available. There was a several hour window when I was not online because I was sleeping, and then going to work. To focus on the "40 minutes before hammer" bullshit because of coincidental circumstances is not a good argument, especially when a known town player in TheIrishman voted at the same time, for the same reasons.

It may be true and it's unfortunate if so, but it's also unverifiable to me. Scum have definitely used the excuse of real life to cover for their timing or other apparent slips before. I can't rule it out.

[Shade939]

8 hours ago, ChopBam said:

@ Shade939  You said you were gonna come back to at least cast a vote today?

Let me give you a practical example of why it doesn't matter what I did today.

##Vote Shade939

I figured it was pretty pointless for me to continue arguing why Category 5 was mafia after everything I did yesterday by the way, and I'd really just be repeating myself at this point.

[ChopBam]

A case could have been made about Retaliation that would have given me pause.

Jeod complained about inactives in the game, so this led me to the possibility that he was expressing frustration due to an inactive teammate who survived due to lack of contribution while Jeod put in a bunch of work and got lynched as a reward.

Irish suspected ChopBam and Retaliation. After clearing ChopBam, Retaliation was Irish's other suspect, although to be fair he didn't put his vote there.

Retaliation would have needed a way to attempt on Louis while being jailed. Could have been explained with item.

This case would have been more plausible to me than the Shade case. But with the way Cat5 carried himself with opening statements today, as well as all the implausible hoops he suggests Shade would have needed to jump through, my suspicion lies elsewhere.

[ChopBam]

9 minutes ago, Shade939 said:

Let me give you a practical example of why it doesn't matter what I did today.

##Vote Shade939

I figured it was pretty pointless for me to continue arguing why Category 5 was mafia after everything I did yesterday by the way, and I'd really just be repeating myself at this point.

So, 3-vote tie between Shade and Cat 5? Didn't see this coming.

[ChopBam]

I noted that your penalty in the pinned message is not in your vote slot, but just tacked on to your name. So I assumed you could still vote, with just an extra out-of-game one tacked on to yourself. Is this not the case? The pinned message would be confusing then.

[FRAYDO]

2 minutes ago, ChopBam said:

A case could have been made about Retaliation that would have given me pause.

Jeod complained about inactives in the game, so this led me to the possibility that he was expressing frustration due to an inactive teammate who survived due to lack of contribution while Jeod put in a bunch of work and got lynched as a reward.

Irish suspected ChopBam and Retaliation. After clearing ChopBam, Retaliation was Irish's other suspect, although to be fair he didn't put his vote there.

Retaliation would have needed a way to attempt on Louis while being jailed. Could have been explained with item.

This case would have been more plausible to me than the Shade case. But with the way Cat5 carried himself with opening statements today, as well as all the implausible hoops he suggests Shade would have needed to jump through, my suspicion lies elsewhere.

DIFFERING TEXT COLORS. SCUM DOC COPY AND PASTE DETECTED.

[ChopBam]

1 minute ago, FRAYDO said:

DIFFERING TEXT COLORS. SCUM DOC COPY AND PASTE DETECTED.

Lmao. Or just shitty forum formatting when you add and remove quotes in posts.

[Shade939]

3 minutes ago, ChopBam said:

I noted that your penalty in the pinned message is not in your vote slot, but just tacked on to your name. So I assumed you could still vote, with just an extra out-of-game one tacked on to yourself. Is this not the case? The pinned message would be confusing then.

What would be the point? It only took one player other than Category 5 to tie the vote against me, and I'm pretty certain the game won't end until Category 5 is lynched. It's a stupid thing to tie at this point of the game, especially with a minority vote count.

[Shade939]

## Unvote

[ChopBam]

4 minutes ago, Shade939 said:

What would be the point? It only took one player other than Category 5 to tie the vote against me, and I'm pretty certain the game won't end until Category 5 is lynched.

The point would be that Category 5 could convince just one person to tie the vote. Convincing people to vote away from them is kind of a main job for scum.

4 minutes ago, Shade939 said:

It's a stupid thing to tie at this point of the game, especially with a minority vote count.

Yes, yes, so that's why it is good that you unvoted.