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My completely neutral take on this: I like rencorner because its the closest thing to vanilla gameplay still left. I like MPF because it has some of the more exotic maps. I like IA (or IK or whatever it's called) because of the structures and more advanced units and no one is pulling off miraculous jump spin head shots through rocks or whatever from 3/4s of the way across the map. As a player, I don't care who made what. As a software engineer myself, I can see where the pissing match starts. I do join wherever the most players are typically, with a little of my mood taken into that decision. I have played in the IA server by myself for hours over the last couple years, and yeah - it sucks with 3 people, but was fun imagining a full server with all the units. I use renlist. However, now that IA has been full because of w3dhub or whatever that is. I don't play APB or any of the other conversions. I've been going there because its a new experience and gameplay when there are 50ppl in a server and still feels like Renegade. That's my 2 cents. I appreciate the work everyone puts into keeping this thing alive still. I don't pretend to know what is involved, but list all the servers on both platforms and everyone would be happy right? seems to be the most reasonable solution.

I was talking about people who removed IA server from renlist because they cant stand competition. they just want status quo. someone once said they care about players, now i see clearly that it was a perfidious lie

My two cents... everyone likes a new flavor of ice cream. Some get upset that their flavor is not as popular. But one fact I’ve seen from working in retail is this... the customer will always look for novelty. (It’s why stores shuffle product locations and companies change the food label’s graphics) some are committed vanilla fans, some prefer chocolate, and some want an every flavor scoop. Once a mod updates it’s flavor/label it will seem new/novel and players will try it out again. Last gem of insight, people are like sheep we like to stick together and move as a herd. (Even loners still like to feel included). Sidenote: getting some ice cream

Please look back at some previous posts and read carefully. W3D Hub is not out to destroy anyone or anything. Our original "mission" here was simply to be a place for all the mod projects that wanted a part in it. Now, this has morphed somewhat, and as danpaul mentioned earlier, we eventually plan to support renegade and list all the servers which wish to be listed on our launcher along with that. Something which we are not in any way obligated to do, but have chosen to do anyway for the good of all W3D communities and projects. No strings attached. EDIT: Clarification: It appeared to me as if you were referring to all parties in this statement. I see now that this might not be the case. Ignore if I misunderstood.

I feel your pain, shai, because I love APB when it gets full which is a rare sight nowadays, and I don't remember to check the launcher every time I hop on my pc to see if there's a decent sized game going. But charging in with guns blazing isn't going to help anyone. Riots1337 put it eloquently, most players won't care how professional or business-like a server owner is, they'll go where the big matches are and as long as server owners are reasonably polite in dealing with matters, nothing else is important to them. Maybe some here think you "look bad" because of your behavior early on in this thread, and maybe you think you're right to be concerned about something you have no control over whisking players away from your server. But strip away all superstitions and you're left with the one simple logical fact: competition isn't going to help an old game like C&C Renegade or even its mods survive. You mentioned server donations etc--what good are those if you're splitting up the community by having several different options but a small playerbase? That's partly why W3DHub only has one official server for our games and not a US Server and EU Server. Costs is one thing, yes, but we don't get full servers every day like a decade ago--so why would we split up our players that way? If you truly care about C&C Renegade's survival, you'll be more approachable and willing to brainstorm ideas rather than threaten the "bad guys". Will you work with us and/or let us work with you?

I understand uncooperative people can block routes due to their own private vision of how they want to build, but you're sending a mixed signal with regards to my response which was based on legitimate defenses being constructed with lots of vehicle space and tunnels were not being blocked in full, plus other people funding them and supporting the way it was built. There is a difference and what you just said can be taken as "oh don't worry, I team hamper too" if perhaps the person on the other end doesn't understand certain English phrasing and differences of intent as fluently as you and I might. If you are not aware of the context of why I responded to him the way I did, don't contribute to it in the dark. It's in our best interest to keep the community supportive, cooperative and promote understanding. This is a team game.

Heated ? You came in here last night with a decision already made with MPF, to pull the server listing if we didn’t comply with what you wanted. No matter what was said the server listing was going to be taken off. It was a strong arm tactic... so I can fully understand why the players are pissed. They are the ones that got screwed by this.

Lol refresh to see my edit

Random sidenote. I had no idea that mixchecker.exe was a thing. I just created a legit Renegade client by installing Scripts 4.6 onto the Renegade multiplayer demo and running mixchecker; then I went and had a couple of games in the RenCorner server. Crazy.

Pushed out one more update. Stock servers shouldn't work at all now.

https://zippy.gfycat.com/WelcomeGloriousIrishredandwhitesetter.webm situation is clear: -very bugged unbalanced MPF with OP Nod and where admins dont care about anything because they think they have players and " its fine as it is" + they insolently stole new version of this mod made by Yap and dblaney and they are hosting it even now-of course they completely ruined it+ they have uncountable exotic bugs which they NEVER cant fix because they dont know how-pretty pathetic xD and -rencorner where players are completely bored after ~1h put together their forces and decided to destroy the only 1 interesting server because its simply much better than mpf+rencorner together

“Competition” as they said. They only seem to care about money, and not what the players enjoy playing.

The patch pushed out today prevents the IA client from joining regular renegade servers btw. Even ones that host their maps on ttfs.

Still not seeing how “Do as we say, or we’ll do it for you.” Is fair. Would it be fair if the tables were turned?

I'm just curios, you made lots of complaints about the imperial age launcher that mpf used because you said it was giving away the ren client when dblaney and ik were on mpf. The arguments were that you could join through relist or whatever cause always.etc was not modified, and the argument pro were none of the stock maps were included,. (I mean you can get the stock maps with mixcheck right?) I agreed with those who opposed it and still do. So I am curious as to why your minds were changed is all. Also I don't think the trolling is helpful.

If you're referring to the fact that we refused his request to run an APB server, it was because MPF was known at the time to heavily mod the game experience from what we deemed appropriate, turning it into something that didn't play or sound like the game that we made at all. Also, there weren't enough players to populate more than one server at the time, so a second one wasn't really required. Otherwise, I don't know what you're referring to.

Please don’t speak on his behalf. That’s bad form.

This like Coke threatening to ban all soda, because more people enjoy Pepsi. 🤔

This isn’t about the community. It’s the fact that they’re here at W3D Hub.

So you’d rather take something away from the players rather than help grow the Ren community?

So let me get this straight. You claim to come over peaceful but have already decided that if we don’t remove it you’ll just remove it anyway. Seem more like a strong arm tactic than a peaceful decision.

The w3dhub channel only shows who's logged into the launcher. You can join servers without being logged in.

Shaitan you need to look in ia-release\IAFiles\InterimApex\ttfs\files. Thats where the IA stuff is. And none of that stuff was made by zunnie.

I honestly can’t believe there’s drama still around with the community as small as it is these days. Are the guys in charge of the game not allowed to do as they please? This can easily be handled in PMs if need be, and I don’t see why this needed to be made public besides trying to cause drama that isn’t needed.

Yes. Next question... edit: This opinion is based from Wallywood and does not reflect the views and opinions of W3D Hub

Long time no see! ?

regular guys

Something I've had to parrot here quite a few times is the sentiment that, for APB, "major development is over". This does not mean all development is over, but it also means we're not completely overhauling the game anymore like the full Beta, Gamma and Delta releases did. Here's a more thorough explanation: I'm satisfied with Delta as it stands, minor bugs/balance issues notwithstanding. The majority of the playerbase seems to be satisfied with it too. Many of the things left to implement from Red Alert are either MASSIVE timesinks, impossible to balance, or impossible to implement period due to engine limitations. I have already spent a ridiculous amount of my free time just fixing Delta up to its current state by myself, because throughout 2015 more and more members of the team either wound up with too many real life issues to contribute much, or they just vanished entirely. The dev team is pretty much down to me and ChopBam at this point and nearly everyone else here is busy with their own projects. I really shouldn't be pouring so much time into this since I'm not getting paid for it. I've enjoyed developing it, sure, but I can't really make it my life. I'm not about to start charging people for this game that has always been free. Especially since the only work I've actually done on it was optimising the balance and tweaking other peoples' maps, and oh yeah, there's copyright issues too. Therefore I am pretty much just here to maintain the current game by fixing bugs and balance problems, and maybe fixing up a few more maps and features that we actually have most of the framework for, because anything bigger is not a good use of my free time. So before pitching your ideas, ask yourself how long you think it would take for one person to do, if you would like to spend that much time doing it, and if it would be worth it. If not, you should probably think smaller. However, even the simplest-sounding undertakings might be stopped by the engine's limitations, and if that's how it is, then that's how it is. I have an idea that will make this gameplay feature more true to Renegade/Reborn/Red Alert! This game is not Renegade or Reborn and is not trying to be. As for Red Alert it was a very flawed game mechanically, tank spam ahoy. Many of its nuances don't translate well to FPS either. APB is more about borrowing RA's setting than its gameplay, though we do try to emulate it in the few places where it's both reasonable to do so and the engine allows us to do so. I have an idea on how to implement a Red Alert unit/power that isn't currently in the game! There's all sorts of reasons why these things aren't currently in the game: You'd better have a model and texture for it already, or know someone who can do them, cause if it's not on this list then that's most likely the primary concern, and for many of the things on this list it's just one of many concerns. Helicarrier: This would be really boring to play as. At least in the similarly unarmed MGG you're right in the action and get to crush people... Plus we don't have a model. Parabombs: Basically a nuke that wouldn't even one-shot buildings, and we lack a complete Tu-16 Badger model. Attack Dog: Spies are definitely not powerful enough to demand a hard counter - plus limitations in how we can mask their identity make them easy enough for players to detect without dogs anyway. If people come up with ideas that'd make the spy more useful, and the scripts team are able to implement them? Then I'll consider it. MCV: APB isn't SimCity. I'd rather not double the length of matches just to make people grind up their bases. The unit itself is ingame already (though it is one of the oldest and ugliest assets that we still have...) but it's only there as an objective unit for custom maps, it can't deploy. Tech Centres: Bases are big enough as they are without more massive structures of dubious purpose. Also, currently lacking the team tech centre models. We may be able to use the NBNW neutral tech centre CMDBob made as an objective somewhere though. Chronosphere/Iron Curtain: While we do have a Chronosphere model, and we may have some feasible scripting logic lying around for it, we don't have a model for the Iron Curtain (only a "destroyed" prop) - and for balance reasons we'd have to introduce both superweapons into the game at the same time. I have an idea for a new map/new take on an existing map! Go ahead and get a discussion started! Just be aware that the further your map idea deviates from standard AOW gameplay, the more likely you are to run into things that either can't be done without jumping a ridiculous amount of hurdles, or just flat out can't be done... or for the map to just not be well-received as has been the case with so many other maps that have deviated greatly from standard AOW gameplay. Also, developing each map is a pretty big time sink. I have an idea to fix this overpowered/underpowered unit or Allied/Soviet biased map! Go ahead and get a discussion started! There's probably a bunch of ways of solving it with a bunch of them being quick and easy to do. Or maybe there's something about the units/maps involved that isn't immediately obvious that I or another regular will be happy to explain. I have a bug to report! File it in the bug tracker. Thank you for your understanding