A Path Beyond Siege Work in Progress Updates

[Raap]

Instead of posting these elsewhere, updates regarding Siege will now be posted here.

A quick recap on what Siege is.

 

Siege is a map I created during Gamma development period of APB. Unfortunately due to several reasons, of which performance was the main reason, it never saw a public release. I will be reviving it now for Delta, and this does mean redoing large parts of the level. Here is what I posted about it in a recent thread:

I know I said I'd provide a preview of Siege this weekend, unfortunately there is a technical issue with my version of the development tools which means this will have to be postponed until next week, when hopefully this will be resolved (essentially my tools are out of date and I need the latest ones, but this is problematic at the present).

For now, I'll provide a Max shot of the current raw layout of the level. Note that for image clarity, I have hidden the foliage (trees, grass, etc.).

If you inspect the base layouts you will notice vulnerabilities. The land routes are well defended from ground attacks but offer no anti-air support. The air power resupply regions of both bases on the other hand, have anti-air support defenses but no protection from ground based attacks. Finally, the rear of each base has practically no defenses altogether. This setup will encourage defenders to "fill the gap" of their defenses themselves, as well as provide clear attack opportunities for the enemy team.

The bases are very spread out, this is primarily to minimize the damage a single A-Bomb flare can do. I was comfortable enough keeping the base buildings this spread, since Delta added infantry sprinting.

Do note that I've only started working on reviving this map this weekend, and you can expect significant changes still (especially in and around the castle, to support the secondary objective).

Three more bits;
- The Allies will have access to the Chinook.
- Neutral castle cannons on the castle walls will be able to deal significant damage to base buildings. Once destroyed, these cannons leave behind indestructible debris that can be repaired, to restore the cannon.
- The Mobile A. A. Gun might make a return in time for Siege to be released. These will be found in limited supply around the castle, they will not respawn, but they can be powerful defensive perks for your team, should you escort them back to your base in safety.

 

As a reminder, the reason I am working on Siege instead of the Fjord remake, is that the Fjord remake is an even bigger project that I need more time for, and I do not want to let down player expectations for it... Siege is my mid term solution so that I can still deliver a new piece of content within a more reasonable time frame.

 

So, as a first teaser update, I've created this short video, showing the functionality of the medieval cannons. NOTE THAT THIS MAP IS IN EARLY DEVELOPMENT AND VERY MUCH A WORK IN PROGRESS!

 

 

* Impact sound is missing from the video due to it not exporting in the mix file, I didn't notice until I uploaded the video.

 

 

Expect more updates as development continues!

Edited May 24, 2016 by Raap

[NodGuy]

I can not wait to play this map again! Keep up the awesome work, Raap.

[Raap]

Small update (but big in terms of development time): The map has been re-textured from scratch.

 

In this process I've split the map terrain file up in two for easier material management; a main terrain file, and a castle file.

 

In the process of re-texturing I've managed cut down approximately 300 unnecessary draw calls without a loss of texture detail, via merging mesh while retaining UVW coordinates.

 

Also, additional texture detail added in places that previously did not have them.

 

Finally, and this will impact gameplay slightly, both team bases will be thematically different; The Allied base is on a grass surface with lots of grass, shrubberies, and trees. The Soviet base is on a concrete/dirt surface with more industrial props laying around.

 

Current estimation is that W3D testers can get their hands on a playable version of the map (without alternate objective) this coming weekend.

Edited May 24, 2016 by Raap

[Death_Kitty]

Im just concerned that the allies superior mobility will lead them to dominate the siege guns, thus leading to another allied bias map.

[Raap]

Don't be alarmed by the seeming appearance of symmetrical map design, there is in fact a lot of asymmetrical balance in place, for example the Soviet side of the castle has an extra way of getting onto the castle walls.

 

Ultimately however, balance is something play testing has to point out. I have largely overhauled the level terrain (and I do mean that, big reworks have gone into the terrain in order to make it easier to adjust when needed later down the line, plus it looks better). I can even still make another infantry route to the opposing base via the river area on the opposite side of the castle, as a last resort (currently that area is "reserved" for air to air combat).

 

Quite a few hours have already gone into Siege. I'm still on schedule for an internal QA release this weekend.

Edited May 25, 2016 by Raap

[Pushwall]

Im just concerned that the allies superior mobility will lead them to dominate the siege guns, thus leading to another allied bias map.

 

Allies don't seem to dominate the oil pumps on pipeline.

 

Allied Chinook access is totally going to lead to Allied bias though, unless each Soviet SAM/rear auxiliary building has an accompanying flame tower or tanyas don't exist. It doesn't seem like it would be hard to fly low and bring in a tanya army and shut down a bunch of SAMs at once or brute-force 1 building with an engy/bunch of sacrificial soldiers.

[Raap]

I always have the option to make the Helipads invulnerable (no target info but still re-supply aircraft as well as enable purchasing), and simply have it blow up when all other buildings are gone. But that's a gimmicky approach I very much prefer to avoid.

 

More base defenses can always be added, I'm just waiting for play-testing feedback because I don't want it to be a stalemate map - Granted, the alternative victory condition takes good care of that regardless, so my concerns are likely misplaced.

 

TLDR: Changes depend on testing feedback.

Edited May 25, 2016 by Raap

[Nodlied]

Raap, how certain are you that you'll have a version ready for the weekend?

[Raap]

Raap, how certain are you that you'll have a version ready for the weekend?

 

Unless something dramatic happens it's pretty much a done deal.

 

Even the current version is already playable. I'm just fixing/improving/updating terrain visuals.

[Nodlied]

Alright then, I shall do my thing when I get the time and prepare a session for the weekend.

[Raap]

Current progress based on rough estimates (updated May 27th):

- Main terrain (grass, hills, mountains, water): 90% completed.

- Main foliage (trees, bushes, grass, seaweed): 40% completed. [Further progress pending 3DS plugin]

- Castle (balcony, ramparts, courtyard, interior): 70% completed.

- Shorelines (waves, underwater, rocks): 80% completed.

- Ore mines (developed as re-usable map asset): 100% completed.

- Base detail (crates, barrels, containers): 20% completed. [Further progress partially pending 3DS plugin]

- Core game mechanics (buildings, C&C Mode): 100% completed.

- Siege mechanics (Cannons, alternate objective): 50% completed.

- Miscellaneous LE tasks (music, map script zones): 50% completed.

- Environmental audio pass (water, wind): 100% completed.

- VIS (aids): 0.00000%

 

QA version one will not have everything 100% completed, but many things will be nearly completed.

 

Edit: Finished up an "APB Cut" edition of Crush Remix for Siege. I've removed the speaking segments and seamlessly transitioned te remaining parts of the track into a single one. You won't even notice it has been cut up when you listen to it.

Edited May 28, 2016 by Raap

[ChopBam]

Looks nice.

 

Are you planning to smooth out the terrain edgeflow marked in red below to be more like the edgeflow marked in green below? The model/alpha blend curves will look much less squarish, giving the map more of a custom/sculpted look (rather than the "I z-pushed a plane" look), and it'll reduce the places where confusion arises from "can I climb here"?

 

I'd also recommend you try working with slight elevation differences within the bases, especially considering they're so spread out. It goes a long way, visually, and that slight uneven feel can make combat that much more interesting.

[Isaac The Madd]

I believe that is what the black vertex colors there are for. Oh, you are talking about the polys there.

He may have already done that as that is not a current screenshot. (He has been working on it for at least five days since that has been taken.)

Edited May 27, 2016 by Isaac The Madd

[Raap]

Looks nice.

 

Are you planning to smooth out the terrain edgeflow marked in red below to be more like the edgeflow marked in green below? The model/alpha blend curves will look much less squarish, giving the map more of a custom/sculpted look (rather than the "I z-pushed a plane" look), and it'll reduce the places where confusion arises from "can I climb here"?

 

I'd also recommend you try working with slight elevation differences within the bases, especially considering they're so spread out. It goes a long way, visually, and that slight uneven feel can make combat that much more interesting.

 

 

The terrain has been overhauled and this is one of the improvements you can expect. Although in some areas I went about it in a different way, relying more on vertex drawing to give areas a more natural look.

 

Here is one example, keep in mind that the shorelines aren't finished yet and foliage isn't added yet.

 

Edited May 27, 2016 by Raap

[Raap]

Here is the current situation:

Current progress based on rough estimates (updated May 27th):
- Main terrain (grass, hills, mountains, water): 90% completed.
- Main foliage (trees, bushes, grass, seaweed): 40% completed. [Further progress pending 3DS plugin]
- Castle (balcony, ramparts, courtyard, interior): 70% completed.
- Shorelines (waves, underwater, rocks): 80% completed.
- Ore mines (developed as re-usable map asset): 100% completed.
- Base detail (crates, barrels, containers): 20% completed. [Further progress partially pending 3DS plugin]
- Core game mechanics (buildings, C&C Mode): 100% completed.
- Siege mechanics (Cannons, alternate objective): 50% completed.
- Miscellaneous LE tasks (music, map script zones): 50% completed.
- Environmental audio pass (water, wind): 100% completed.
- VIS (aids): 0.00000%


The ore mine is done, and designed for optional re-use in maps via proxy placement (it's basically a building). Once Siege is completed, people can use it if they wish.

It took more time to finish the mine than I anticipated since I had to make sure there were no light solve oddities.

Edit: Erf, since I got nothing better to show, here is said mine:






Some of the smaller details are hard to spot from these camera angles, such as electrical wiring.

Edited May 28, 2016 by Raap

[Raap]

First QA testing session is concluded.

 

Expect significant map layout changes based on feedback.

 

The biggest change will be the removal of Missile Silos as they turned out to be too much of a negative effect on gameplay.

 

Another big change will be a dramatic overhaul of faction bases.

[Raap]

Here is a second pass on the Allied base, minus detail objects. As you can see, the base is a lot more compact, and there are elevation differences between buildings in order to eliminate the flat surfaces (The CY and WF are on a hill, the Barracks is in a lower ditch).

 

The ore mine will be under the castle, meaning the Ore Truck(s) have to actually drive towards the action, rather than away from it.

 

[Raap]

Sorted out my plugin issue today, so I will be able to correctly populate the level with grass, bushes, trees, and whatever else needs to be sprayed around wildly. This also means I will redo the grass on the map since from air view the grass clusters looked too round and unnatural. In other words, I need to create a few new foliage assets.

 

On other news, there is an expanded tunnel/ore mine system beneath the castle courtyard now, with main entrances near the castle vehicle entrances, and infantry-only entrances connecting to the central "trench". The whole place has been re-textured for both consistency, and thematic logic (Why was there dry desert rocks in a wet grassland on top of grey rock formations? We will never know!).

 

A preview will be provided once I finalize a few remaining details.

 

Next up is the redesign of the Soviet base, which will be made more compact, but also moved closer to the castle (the location style of where it is built is also changed).

Edited June 1, 2016 by Raap

[NodGuy]

The Allied base is looking good, I'm excited to see what the Soviet base looks like.

[Raap]

Very different, and I don't want to hear another word of bases lacking elevation differences after this one is completed.

 

Just finished the "transitional" cave system, these are the caves leading up to the ore mines. Unfortunately since I had to proxy these as well, I cannot provide a decent image to show them, so you'll have to hold on until the map is finished.

 

Edit: This is what that looks like, keep in mind there are a few texture seam issues to correct, a side effect from having to work with several different 3DS files for one level. Also note I made a mistake and the support beams are a bit too low, the Ore Truck bumps into them (oops):

 

 

 

 

Next update will be regarding the Soviet base... After that, I'll keep the rest under wraps until release.

Edited June 2, 2016 by Raap

[Raap]

Small update for those that care; Still working on it, but RL hit me on the head as I suddenly found myself having to secure a bigger budget for an unexpected living location change happening in august.

 

I will absolutely be finishing this level and I'm not running off without doing so (I visit these forums daily). And I absolutely still plan on the Fjord remake after Siege is done.

 

I confess that Siege has, once again, outgrown the initial development scope. The plan was a "quick fix-up" to release something within a reasonable time frame, but both play testing as well as my personal wishes for the level, indicated that a simple fix-up would not result in a fun level to play on. Frankly, during the play test, the level was downright boring to play on. This meant I had to plan a number of large changes (such as the bases), which takes more time to complete. I would have been done about now however, were it not for RL priorities.

 

With that being said, beyond Siege and Fjord, I am not planning any further levels for APB. In part due to not wanting to promise things I might not be able to deliver, but also due to reserve my right to change my mind.

 

On a positive note, perhaps by the time Siege is finished, some fancy programmer dude developed a replacement method for creating W3D files so I no longer have to use horrific tools like 3DS Max 8, usage of which currently is the digital equivalent of pulling your own nails off with a screwdriver; A terribly messy and painfully slow process.

Edited June 26, 2016 by Raap

[Raptor29aa]

I appreciate the time invested in this. And Sometimes it's the simple things that matter most. Like finding a flamer thrower crate when you an RS or driving an AA truck or operating a cannon.

RL is already complicated enough that we escape into simplicity. I keep telling myself that at least. (Like calm down, it's only a rugby game: simply a ball traveling into score zone no need to threaten the other player or yell at the referee.)

Edited June 28, 2016 by Raptor29aa

[Raap]

Slow progress continues, as I've had a chance to put a few hours in over the past three days.

 

Still no ETA, but it's slowly getting there. If I did my job correctly, you'll have a hard time recognizing the map when you get to play it.

 

As for the alternate victory condition, I've had to change the original plan for "king of multiple hills" due to not having anyone to program such functionality. But with all the dramatic changes to the map, a true alternate victory condition might no longer be required. Rest assured, there will be a solid amount of map-specific content including the cannons, as well as a number of secrets (including one very extensive secret that will take players months to figure out).

[Ice]

Sounds good, can hardly wait to see it.

 

On a side note, have you ever considered downsizing the cannons a bit? They're extremely big.

 

Anyway, looking forward to seeing this map again. It was awesome before so I can only imagine how awesome it's gonna be now!

[Raap]

Sounds good, can hardly wait to see it.

 

On a side note, have you ever considered downsizing the cannons a bit? They're extremely big.

 

Anyway, looking forward to seeing this map again. It was awesome before so I can only imagine how awesome it's gonna be now!

 

I can't really make them smaller because then the infantry model would look strange in the seat.

 

Cannons IRL are not small either. The turning platform and ability to raise the cannon angle is obviously not based on real word designs, but the rest is.

[SarahNautili]

(including one very extensive secret that will take players months to figure out).

Ya know, every time I can think of a dev claiming this, it's been followed by, some time not long after, a "never underestimate players" comment when it's figured out within days.

[Raap]

 

(including one very extensive secret that will take players months to figure out).

Ya know, every time I can think of a dev claiming this, it's been followed by, some time not long after, a "never underestimate players" comment when it's figured out within days.

 

 

We will see about that in this case. Even if you data-mined information, who can say you can puzzle the pieces in the correct places? Worth noting is that the idea of any bonus area, is to have it be fun to try reach it, not impossible. If something is impossible to reach, then I failed as a content designer.

 

Rest assured however that the bulk of my time goes into developing the main area of the map itself. I just had some space to fill and old assets to make use out of.

 

I've already had to make several new textures for the map as well. The problem with having a large object like a castle wall covering such a large percentage of screen view is making sure it doesn't look too tiled, so I've had to use a specific method on making it look better, without going overboard on more system taxing visuals.

Edited July 7, 2016 by Raap

[ChopBam]

I've already had to make several new textures for the map as well. The problem with having a large object like a castle wall covering such a large percentage of screen view is making sure it doesn't look too tiled, so I've had to use a specific method on making it look better, without going overboard on more system taxing visuals.

Yeah that can be real tricky.

[Raap]

 

I've already had to make several new textures for the map as well. The problem with having a large object like a castle wall covering such a large percentage of screen view is making sure it doesn't look too tiled, so I've had to use a specific method on making it look better, without going overboard on more system taxing visuals.

Yeah that can be real tricky.

 

 

Yeap, fortunately the wall is a man-made object and not, let's say, a cliff or anything else that is part of the core terrain and intended to look smooth in terms of material transition. In this particular case I've created several (still working on the exact final number) "copies" of the wall texture, but with alterations. Using the same UVW coordinates I can seamlessly mix these textures across the wall to create variation, as well as additional geometry tweaks to make sure it all looks different.

 

That's just the outward facing wall for now. The inward facing side of the wall will be more traditional in terms of material detail, since making several textures for each section of the level would take too long.

 

The good news is, I suppose Siege is nearly an "urban/industrial" map in some ways, due to the amount of man-made terrain as cover. And that was a very popular request for APB maps.

Edited July 7, 2016 by Raap

[ChopBam]

I look forward to seeing how it pans out!