RA_Village (warning newbie)

[Raptor29aa]

 

This is a concept drawing (more and better pictures to come)

This is a map I'd like to create

each base has two exits wide enough for tanks.

One narrow exit is blocked by hedgehog and leads to capturable oil pumps.

The wide exit leads to a town.

Forest is in the middle (might add lake or trenches or something later... not sure, but forest for now)

Also main road out of town has a turnout for Ore Field (maybe mixed field)

 

(Warning: I am a total novice at map making... but I will give it my best shot! And I will try to update frequently)

 

Bases:

A few pillboxes/FlameTowers

War Factory and Barracks

Refinery and service depot

Tech level: 5

 

Let me know if you have any idea(s)/input

I will begin to model in 3ds max soon

[NodGuy]

Oooh, new map, how exciting.

 

I think a shallow lake (deep in the middle maybe?) with the forest would be pretty cool.

[delta]

TREES!!

REMOVE!!

 

 

 

Also coincidentally, just as I was reading this, Andrew Zimmern came on the TV and explained how the Faroe Islands had no trees because of some peculiarity about the climate or something. I think you should make a map of the Faroe Islands.

[MPRA2]

As what Delta said, trees are too OP.

as for my map ideas, I am currently suffering through an extreme phase of PROCRASTINATION!

so i'll get around to 3dsmax whenever.... dont expect it to be until august or something.

[Raptor29aa]

I do like the idea of a shallow lake.

I wonder why there is a dislike of trees at the edge of a base?

Or did I hear you wrong and it's forest combat you dislike?

I know that trees near a road would bother a v2 driver so I'll take that into consideration. (At the same time it would double as cover).

[delta]

Oh, it's just that trees make me rage because you'll be in a Medium Tank and under attack by a shock trooper, and then you start to back up only to find that a TREE has appeared right behind you and is blocking your escape, and then it's ZAPZAPZAPZAPZAPZAPZAP.

 

On a more serious note, I would just say keep the tree density down so that it's not so much of a pain to drive through a grove...and make it less likely that you'll lag into one in the process.

[Raptor29aa]

I see your point. The I will make the main road wide and the town will have no tress in it.

I'm going to have a more detailed schematic on graph paper. Since ms paint doesn't do me any justice.

[Raap]

I'll look forward to seeing what you manage to set up in 3DS. When you get to a certain point in development that reaches more technical matters, such as how to set up certain things in order for them to work in-game, poke me and I can give you any information you need.

 

I'm not sure when APB's SDK will see release. AFAIK it is mostly ready but pending documentation. That shouldn't really hold you from making your level in 3DS though; All the textures APB uses can be extracted from the always.dat using a tool like XCC Mixer. And if you need a scale reference you can use W3D importer to import a W3D file of an existing level or building. The tutorials section already covers a load of general subjects, you're really just missing some APB Delta specifics... And ultimately it all comes down to your own mastery of the tools (and understanding the limits, etc.).

[Raptor29aa]

That's true I do lack a lot of the skills + tools, but I do have some 3ds max experience.

I know I'll need to get the models and the textures.

I have little to no experience with LvL edit.

But I won't let that stop me.

I figure the biggest obstacle is getting the terrain done.

(Or at least the biggest right now)

I'll post my graph paper sketch soon. I'm working on the estimated size of the war factory. I think it's 50x50x15.

So on graph paper it will be a 3x3 square.

With this perspective I might be able to paper map it.

Once the graph paper design is done I'll then transfer the info to 3ds max.

(more 3ds max screen shots in the future I promise)

Edited June 15, 2016 by Raptor29aa

[moonsense715]

Should you need help modeling or setting up your level, don't forget we have a large tutorial database that can help you out.
https://secure.w3dhub.com/forum/index.php?showforum=176

[Raap]

I figure the biggest obstacle is getting the terrain done.

 

 

It takes a lot of time if you want to do it right. The cave system on Siege for example is fairly small but easily took me about 8 hours to make, this includes the model work, as well as texturing, collision and W3D settings, and error correcting. I could easily put more hours into anything I make, and typically, more hours translate into better quality and detail. At some point you need to call it a day though because you'll end up spending too much time on one thing or reach W3D limitations.

 

What I personally find works for me, is deadlines. It acts as a constant mental note that I need to wrap things up after spending X amount of time on a specific part of a level. For your first project you should not focus on delivering anything though, but rather to just learn things for yourself. I believe I said it before somewhere else; Your first level should be developed with no intention to release it, and purely focus on learning. Then your next project can be your first real release-worthy level, since you will have started developing it from the beginning with a better understanding of things.

 

A shining example is my earliest work for APB during 9935. That stuff was just plain awful, hastily created in order to release more levels as quickly as possible. Granted I was a lot younger then as well.

Edited June 16, 2016 by Raap

[Raptor29aa]

Ok I have the map graphed out

Here

 

@Raap I know I've had 3 other attempts before this one. And I gave up when it came to level edit work.

 

I won't have a lot of time to devote to this but I will post periodically.

now that I have a map 3ds max stuff will happen soon...

[Pushwall]

Is there really that little space between the two bases? Looks like a B2B mad tank/arty/v2 paradise even more so than river raid.

 

Are the forests supposed to be completely impassable to vehicles or just an annoyance for them? Cause if it's the latter then that's definitely too little space between the bases.

[Raptor29aa]

Yea the idea was to make it impassible, because tree annoyance will most likely annoy me.

I will definitely make the gap between bases larger.

(Thank you for the input, Mads would be a big problem here in that case and so would base 2 base).

[Ice]

Nice concept, looking forward to seeing your work! If you need any help making assets, I can probably help.

[FRAYDO]

As far as I can throw in for input, your proposed base layout and resource collection areas are too symmetrical. If there is one common theme among map concepts, it would be that.

 

In other news, you'll be happy to know the APB SDK will be releasing soon.

[MPRA2]

As far as I can throw in for input, your proposed base layout and resource collection areas are too symmetrical. If there is one common theme among map concepts, it would be that.

 

In other news, you'll be happy to know the APB SDK will be releasing soon.

simple map-making will be a thing!? finally..... I can put an end to my procrastination...

[Raap]

 

As far as I can throw in for input, your proposed base layout and resource collection areas are too symmetrical. If there is one common theme among map concepts, it would be that.

 

In other news, you'll be happy to know the APB SDK will be releasing soon.

simple map-making will be a thing!? finally..... I can put an end to my procrastination...

 

 

Define "simple"? The SDK contains the tools needed to add game logic to your 3DS-designed levels, not a magic wand that makes level design "simple".

[Isaac The Madd]

As long as it fixes the LevelEdit bug, that won't let it read the scripts, I'm fine.

[Raap]

That's a registry issue. Have you used something like CCleaner? Older versions of it have been known to delete some LE registry entries (the current version doesn't have this problem).

 

I'm not sure what the updated tools change specifically in regards to this - my tools are also outdated by now. With some luck, Pushwall can provide a quick overview on whats different in the updated tool set.

Edited June 21, 2016 by Raap

[Raptor29aa]

Thanks for the input In Addison to increasing the center and I'll get more creative with ore and gems. I figure the Gem field should be off to the side and make the ore field more centered.

I figure each team should have no silo and maybe I should add another oil pump.

Also I've fired up 3ds Max 8 and made a 600x600 plane. (Not sure if that's large enough, and will do more later... Picture will soon follow)

PS looking forward to the new tools. (Also I realized why my previous worlds didn't show up in LvL edit... I forgot to hit the "make" button.)

Edited June 22, 2016 by Raptor29aa

[Ice]

I'd also recommend playing around with the base layouts so they're not mirror images of each other, and generally making the map terrain less symmetrical.

Edited June 22, 2016 by Ice

[Raptor29aa]

Since The bases are only 4 buildings I am not sure how much remixing I can do. I figure I can make the terrain differ in or near the bases.

Anyways here is an hour's worth of using 3ds max. I figure I will design the terrain then make a texture map. Then use that texture map to make a much smoother plane.

 

[Raap]

I would not recommend using the mirror tool for terrain, it creates a very copy pasted feeling.

 

Using a plane mesh and using only Z-axis movement of vertices should pretty much exclusively be used for open landscapes as it is an easy and effective way of creating a smooth looking surface. In any other case you will want to manually shape the terrain.

 

Best example here for you is your hills, which I assume are supposed to become an impassable barrier that boxes in your playable space. By using Z-axis movement to shape it you will get a lot of jagged corners, which has a range of different complications as a result.

 

But proceeding from this point onward is possible. First, activate the snapping option, then within the editable poly menu, locate the cut option. This option will allow you to essentially carve into your plane mesh from verticy to verticy (the snapping tool ensures you cut from corner to corner without creating unnecessary additional polygons which would make the mesh harder to work with later), this way you can "draw" which direction the polygon edges face and in this way, remove the jagged appearance of the terrain.

 

That's just one little thing you should do, there is a lot of things you can do to make things look better, but you will have to just experiment with what works for you or not. There really isn't a 100% shared path that content creators have, everyone has their methods, what matters is that the end result both functions and looks as you want it to.

[ChopBam]

I honestly wouldn't use the cut tool to shape terrain (extruding cliffs, etc) unless you're adding definition to terrain that's already there. Manual extrusions is time-consuming but the best way, as it allows you to create exactly what you want. The flatter ground's edgeflow should complement the cliff shape.

[Raap]

I honestly wouldn't use the cut tool to shape terrain (extruding cliffs, etc) unless you're adding definition to terrain that's already there. Manual extrusions is time-consuming but the best way, as it allows you to create exactly what you want. The flatter ground's edgeflow should complement the cliff shape.

 

As I said, everyone got their methods. Extruding things certainly works as well, and it is something you will inevitably also end up doing in various places (same applies to many other tools), but you will always run into situations where you will have to edit mesh in other ways, including cutting, for example to correct light solve problems.

Edited June 26, 2016 by Raap

[ChopBam]

"Adding definition to terrain that's already there" covers things like fixing lightsolve problems, areas with too low of a poly resolution, and traversibility issues.

 

I would argue that extrusion is the best way to create well-shaped terrain, and fixes all sorts of problems before they occur.

[Raap]

I'm not disagreeing - I simply suggested there are more ways to go about things. The cutting example was given as a proposed solution to issues seen in Raptor's image. Your answer requires a restart of the work in order for it to properly function to the best effect.

 

Historically my work for APB has always been mostly revolving around editing and fixing issues, so as a result I generally think from that point of view. My last two contributions are no different, originating primarily from old work (HW dating back to 2006, Siege to ~2011).

 

It's always a lot easier to work "clean" on a fresh project, which is why some of my newer assets are less messy.

 

Edit: To be clear however, ChopBam has a lot more experience in this work than I do (I do not do this for a living). So please don't consider my point of view in any way as something that de-values Chop's input.

Edited June 26, 2016 by Raap

[Isaac The Madd]

That's a registry issue. Have you used something like CCleaner? Older versions of it have been known to delete some LE registry entries (the current version doesn't have this problem).

 

I'm not sure what the updated tools change specifically in regards to this - my tools are also outdated by now. With some luck, Pushwall can provide a quick overview on whats different in the updated tool set.

I have never run cleaning tools on this PC, but no LevelEdit Registries exist on this PC (unless you mean an install path entry on the games registry which does exist on my computer.)

 

Edit: I my recent attempts at terrain have been making a plane in blender then displacing that with a heightmap, after which I subserf and decimate it.

Edited June 27, 2016 by Isaac The Madd

[Raap]

Edit: I my recent attempts at terrain have been making a plane in blender then displacing that with a heightmap, after which I subserf and decimate it.

 

By heightmap you mean an image file that scales the height of vertices based on an RGB value?

 

If so, don't do that, you will get very poor results and you'll spend more time fixing things than you would have if you simply made the mesh yourself.

 

Making a plane with Z-axis movement only, is the most simple thing you can do in a 3D program. You shouldn't need special methods to create this, because frankly, if you struggle at this point, you need to learn the basics anyhow.

 

I've personally never used blender, although in the past it was reportedly resulting in meshes not optimized for games due to the way blender creates meshes. I don't know what it is like today.