Games [GAME OVER] Tiberian Sun: Reborn Mafia I

[Retaliation]

3 minutes ago, Shade939 said:

No, it was still a good indicator of roles based on the results.

Obviously you wouldn't 

[Killing_You]

 

31 minutes ago, iLikeToSnipe said:

To be perfectly honest, I don't know how Nod could win this game without major luck if they went up against a competent town. Even with inactive town players and some decent luck I don't think this would have reasonably winnable. The majority of town targets could have been BP N1 (or any other night depending on if they held off on their ability). Town also had two protective roles and another role that had some pretty good (and interestingly designed) BP. All this combines into a TON of information gathering for town and very little that mafia can exploit.

In my defense, I tried to take into account the possibility of Town roles interfering with other Town roles (Riot Trooper and JumpJet, namely), and I think it's possible that Scum could've won in this setup. I did spot some holes in my original mindset, which will be rectified next game.

30 minutes ago, Shade939 said:

The number and types of roles in game was fairly necessary in order to actually know what was going on, and get the style of game play we had going on.

You might add in something like a mystery role though, that could be from several different known options.

I did have a mystery role, though; the JumpJet. There was also a plan for Nod to have a Confessor (which would've had a silencing ability), but Nod needed all of their more powerful roles for this game. I like the concept of a complete mystery because it adds a bit of uncertainty to the game, making it more interesting IMO.

[Retaliation]

I'm wondering if I should take the warhammer attack sequence (To hit, to wound, to save) to make a game more like this.

[Shade939]

3 minutes ago, Retaliation said:

I'm wondering if I should take the warhammer attack sequence (To hit, to wound, to save) to make a game more like this.

Wounds would definitely be a good stat to use at least. Combine to hit and save into the same roll just to save yourself some time.

Might just make it an opposing variable for a %Chance to Wound with To Hit gives +%Chance and To Save gives -%Chance

[Shade939]

6 minutes ago, Retaliation said:

I'm wondering if I should take the warhammer attack sequence (To hit, to wound, to save) to make a game more like this.

Main point of the separate stuck/kill chances was to help with the Spy role for this game. So unless you're using a game play mechanic like that for roles, do yourself a favor and simplify how quickly you can resolve the action.

[Retaliation]

I'd probably start out using actual 40k stats so if it works out I could use stat engines already setup to deal with that.

Plus then I could roll actual dice to resolve your shots :v.

[Shade939]

6 minutes ago, Retaliation said:

I'd probably start out using actual 40k stats so if it works out I could use stat engines already setup to deal with that.

Plus then I could roll actual dice to resolve your shots :v.

Dice rolls, where even a guardsman can slay someone in power armor.

[Killing_You]

4 minutes ago, Retaliation said:

I'd probably start out using actual 40k stats so if it works out I could use stat engines already setup to deal with that.

Plus then I could roll actual dice to resolve your shots :v.

>implying I didn't  (I have physical dice at my desk to continue playing tabletop games with friends via Facebook messenger calls, so it was easier than trying to find an online number generator)

[ChopBam]

@Killing_You You did a stellar job setting this up, in my opinion. I had a blast. Thank you thank you for hosting!

[Killing_You]

Just now, ChopBam said:

@Killing_You You did a stellar job setting this up, in my opinion. I had a blast. Thank you thank you for hosting!

You're very welcome! As I said in the dead doc, I think TSR mafia is a good fit for me to GM, and I'm looking forward to iterating on this further!

And a big THANK YOU to all who played! It's the players that make the game, after all!

[Mojoman]

Yeah, really good game Killing_You, thank you very much!~

[Louis]

Wait so I was right on For being scum nice, and damn I come back to this

[Nodlied]

7 hours ago, Shade939 said:

Dice rolls, where even a guardsman can slay someone in power armor.

IIRC, you need around 66.5pts worth of Guardsmen to kill 25pts of Space Marines. It's not fair.

[Voe]

5 town power roles and 5 vanilla townies vs 2 scum power roles and 1 chamspy felt unfair.

In a regular set up this could probably have worked, but in a gunslinger game where everyone has a weapon, scum isn't just outgunned 3:1, but 5:1 due to the uselessness of the Spy. Spy who will eventually need to out himself, no matter how the game goes on. I could have played honest to god best townie match of among us, but in the end i'd have been the only stuck person who hasn't yet been lynched and thus a guaranteed Nod.

Other than that, you did a good, KY.

[Voe]

(also, Spy's own power of fooling investigators is null and void in a match where you "investigate" players by shooting them during day phase)

[iLikeToSnipe]

I really did like the setup where everyone has a gun. It made this game especially active, which is a good thing.

[Voe]

Oh, I'm not trying to say the setup is bad, i like it, but having a singled out role which cannot shoot successfully hinders it too much.

[Jeod]

Verti evolved the setup from such feedback that he began to include vehicles and buildings in a semi-open setup that kept everyone guessing what roles existed. I would like to see some vehicles in TSR 2, specifically so Nod has more options.

[Jeod]

Also, I learned a bit from this game on why CYOR can be rather stale:

1) Everyone has a similar day action, separated only by rng or special role (always stuck)

2) Multiples of a specific role (5 light infantries)

CYOR's supposed to substitute this by eliminating obvious role-faction relation in player characters i.e. villains aren't always scum. Doesn't always happen though and the gunslinging does add to the activity. When it comes to the bottom line, a mystery element in how statistics and mechanics work does wonders for game discussion.

[Voe]

@Jeod One of the reasons i stopped playing Mafia was that the only games hosted became CYOR.

CYOR lacks the strategic element for me. It's less deliberate and more of a wild ride. While I like a wild ride from time to time, I prefer the intellectual part of mafia. It's why I'm the biggest fan of Vertigo mafias such as DeadSpace, which were a mix of both.

[OrangeP47]

I'm a big fan of CYOR, but I think we could get some of the CYOR charm back by maybe having some more *themed* CYORs again.  The total freeform is fun, but we tend to have good results when our creativity is, so to speak, directed down a certain path.

[Jeod]

14 minutes ago, OrangeP47 said:

I'm a big fan of CYOR, but I think we could get some of the CYOR charm back by maybe having some more *themed* CYORs again.  The total freeform is fun, but we tend to have good results when our creativity is, so to speak, directed down a certain path.

I could put together a C&C themed cyor that's sort of like these setups but you pick your units from whatever C&C universe is chosen.

[Jeod]

Alternatively I can try my hand at "AR Mafia I".

[OrangeP47]

Either would be decent options.  Resume in January though.

[iLikeToSnipe]

47 minutes ago, Jeod said:

I could put together a C&C themed cyor that's sort of like these setups but you pick your units from whatever C&C universe is chosen.

I've thought about some kind of role/ability buy system for a game. I think that'd make much more sense for a C&C game. Maybe it's been done before, but I haven't really followed the APB games so I don't know.

My idea was that mafia gets a shared pool of credits and each town player has their own pool. Town players can donate credits if they want or stockpile them. Mafia credits have a low passive income and each town player has a higher passive income. You get the credits of anyone you kill. So maybe it'd make sense to shoot that inactive that's bothering you, even though you think they're town. Mafia also have this as another incentive for the night kill since they get credits from kills.

At the end of each day phase, there's a buy/night phase. You can buy abilities (more expensive) or items (less expensive). Items can also be taken upon death, so it can be risky. It's just one of several ideas I've had but haven't had the time to do.

[OrangeP47]

21 minutes ago, iLikeToSnipe said:

I've thought about some kind of role/ability buy system for a game. I think that'd make much more sense for a C&C game. Maybe it's been done before, but I haven't really followed the APB games so I don't know.

My idea was that mafia gets a shared pool of credits and each town player has their own pool. Town players can donate credits if they want or stockpile them. Mafia credits have a low passive income and each town player has a higher passive income. You get the credits of anyone you kill. So maybe it'd make sense to shoot that inactive that's bothering you, even though you think they're town. Mafia also have this as another incentive for the night kill since they get credits from kills.

At the end of each day phase, there's a buy/night phase. You can buy abilities (more expensive) or items (less expensive). Items can also be taken upon death, so it can be risky. It's just one of several ideas I've had but haven't had the time to do.

That could be true APB Mafia with harvester dumps and whatnot.

[iLikeToSnipe]

5 minutes ago, OrangeP47 said:

That could be true APB Mafia with harvester dumps and whatnot.

I'd also have base classes that everyone would be assigned randomly (the amount and type would be where the foundational balance for the game comes from). So maybe certain abilities (i.e. cop ability) can only be purchased by a specific base class or an item has bonus effects for different classes.

When I have time to host a game (sometime in 2021) I can just create a topic with a poll on what to run.

[Killing_You]

5 hours ago, Jeod said:

Verti evolved the setup from such feedback that he began to include vehicles and buildings in a semi-open setup that kept everyone guessing what roles existed. I would like to see some vehicles in TSR 2, specifically so Nod has more options.

I can confirm that vehicles and non-shooting roles will most certainly be on the role sheet for next game. I've gotten plenty of ideas for roles now that I've seen some of the drawbacks of this setup in practice.

Buildings will probably wait until TSR 3, however. I can confirm that there will not be any permanently unlynchable Nod buildings in any setup. Whatever I do for Nod buildings, I'll do for GDI buildings as well, to avoid meta arguments in that area.

[Jeod]

Welp, I've gotten some inspiration for Apoc Rising Mafia I. Time to go to the drawing board.

[Killing_You]

5 hours ago, Voe said:

@Jeod One of the reasons i stopped playing Mafia was that the only games hosted became CYOR.

CYOR lacks the strategic element for me. It's less deliberate and more of a wild ride. While I like a wild ride from time to time, I prefer the intellectual part of mafia. It's why I'm the biggest fan of Vertigo mafias such as DeadSpace, which were a mix of both.

Well, I hope you're able to be a regular player for TSR Mafia and any similar Mafias that follow. It was good to have you back as a player.