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For the engineers out there who has been wanting to figure out how to modernize the Westwood 3D and/or Strategy Action Game Engine, this is for you. I have decided to impart all that I've scrounged up on both engines in the hopes it will be useful to someone in the community at large. A brief history of WW3D Engines begin somewhere, and for Westwood Studios' first 3D engine, they built theirs off an existing 3D engine. That engine was the SurRender 3D engine by Hybrid Graphics (now Umbra under Amazon). That was a 5 year odyssey that started in 1997 with Project "Commando" and ended (after two delays) in 2002 with C&C Renegade. The longest game development in Westwood Studios history (C&C Tib Dawn and Tiberian Sun were each 4 years by comparison), but, to be fair, it was both Westwood's first fully 3D project and first person shooter (and a hybrid one at that). When Westwood Pacific (EA Pacific/EALA) was looking to make a new 3D engine for RTS games, they considered multiple engines such as id Software's id Tech 3 (the "Quake III engine"), Epic Games' Unreal Tech Engine (likely Unreal 2), and Monolith Productions' LithTech, but settled on an in-house engine they already owned for SAGE. After Westwood was shuttered and reborn as Petroglyph Games, they too built their Alamo Engine based on the Westwood 3D engine, and then their modern GlyphX Engine after that. Yes, GlyphX is the most modern implementation of the WW3D engine, though GlyphX is more like a fusion of the capabilities of WW3D and SAGE/Alamo. So it's for more than RTS games. So, with that out of the way, let's take a look under the hood. The Westwood 3D Engine Genealogy At A Glance It's best to start with a visual aide to see how these engines branched off and what Application Programming Interface (API) they use. Attached is a simple flowchart I made that tracks the evolution of the engine from SurRender 3D all the way to SAGE2 and GlyphX. If the image (for whatever reason) never loads or is lost in the future, the genealogy looks like the below: [SurRender 3D (OpenGL)] -> [WW3D (DirectX8.1)] -> [SAGE 1 (DirectX9)] & [Alamo Engine (DirectX9)] -> [SAGE 2 (DirectX10)] & [GlyphX Engine (DirectX10, 11, 12)] Yes, that is correct, the engine originated with the OpenGL API before immediately switching to the DirectX API. This was done because Westwood had more experience working with the Windows API than others at that point. This could suggest that the main game code for WW3D and SAGE is API agnostic, but there is much of the code that was built for MS Windows programs which entails extra work to create something that also works on other OS's like Unix/Linux (though Steam already wraps all games in a wrapper that allows them to run in the Unix/Linux environment regardless). The Graphical API (the Construction Yard of the engine) So with that, the first and most obvious improvement for the engine lies with the graphical API. Renegade was built on DX8.1, the same API that the DirectX Box (Xbox OG) was built on and C&C Generals was built on the next iteration with DX9, the same version of the API used for the Xbox 360. Now, most of you are probably chomping at the bit, wanting to use the most recent iteration of DirectX as the chosen upgrade. I do not advise that. DirectX12, like with Vulkan, is a low level graphical API that is built with C, unlike older DirectX versions and OpenGL, which both are built in C++. So there is a whole learning curve to overcome that even some developers have struggled with. Hence, the best choice would be DirectX11 since it's still in C++ and you can use it as a fallback renderer for when you do choose to implement DX12 (like most companies do). A similar dual API technique is done with OpenGL and Vulkan (like how id Software implemented id Tech 6). With the API upgraded, we can have access to many modern features, such as superior texture compression (BC6 and BC7) and material shaders in line with the most recent version of WW3D (GlpyhX). Although DX8.1 and DX9 do have texture compression (via DXT) and can do material shaders, they are comparatively primitive and restrictive. So if you choose to continue to use the old API, I'm just letting you know that you can still do some advanced tricks. All versions of DirectX can be downloaded directly from Microsoft's site. Though it should be noted that all of DirectX's libraries are integrated with Windows' libraries (Windows.h). You can get Window library headers here for development: Windows Implementation Library. OpenGL and Vulkan can be downloaded from Khronos Group's Github. All can be integrated within Visual Studio. All necessary for compiling new .dll files for the engine. Some DX11 samples and tutorials: DirectX SDK Samples Wiki RAD Tools and Their RADical Uses (and their replacements) RAD Tools were some of the most popular proprietary engine tools of their time.... that was until Epic Games bought them out and they were surpassed in multiple aspects. Thus it's not all too necessary to replace all of them, but one in particular will need an urgent replacement. WW3D and SAGE both use them, so let's evaluate each one individually. BINK Video (for Cutscenes and EVA Unit videos that play in the Radar) When you need to compress a video file so that it fits on a CD/DVD disk, you either have to create your own method of compression, or use someone else's. For many, that solution is BINK Video. You've probably seen the little twister logo on many a game splash screen on start up, well I'm here to tell you that BINK is for real time video compression and file reading. Like a file zipper/unzipper for video files. BINK comes in two versions: BINK 1 (.bik files) and BINK 2 (.bk2/.bik2 files). BINK 1 is what all WW3D, SAGE 1, and Alamo games used for their video files, while SAGE 2 and GlyphX started using BINK 2. The major difference between the two versions of BINK is that the second edition requires that your engine's Math library contains SSE (specifically SSE2 or later if I recall correctly) in order for it to work (oh and BINK 2 is of a higher quality and compression than BINK 1). That's not a calculation that either WW3D nor SAGE can do (as they have the same WestWood Math library). This will be expanded in a later section regarding the Math Library and Physics Library. So if you want to continue to use BINK, you're in luck! It's still the industry standard for video compression (found natively in Unreal and Unity) so it's not too difficult to implement. There is, however, one catch: BINK is propriety software, and thus you will have to pay for it if you choose to sell your game/project on the market. If not? Well then you can download the tool and SDK and use them as you please, but do be mindful that if you are to go commercial, you will need a license to continue using it. The running price for a BINK license is $11,000 USD per game and per platform. No free lunch. [BINK Link] If that's too many credits, then I do have an alternative for you open source adherents and it's the WebM format! It's open source, free to use, and offers superior compression than BINK 2! However, you will have to adapt the source code to replace the all the BINK code references with WebM (and update the Math Library all the same). Not too hard, but work all the same. Companies like Valve have replaced BINK with WebM in Source 2, so there's your big dev implementation. [WebM site (go to Codec for source code)] The Miles Sound System (for epic SFX, Spacial Audio, and the Soundtrack output) [DEFUNCT] Westwood Studios games, and EALA by extension, are well known for their awesome audio. Great sound mixing, rich SFX, and even 3D audio for that EAX (Environmental Audio Extensions) experience that allows for echos and accurate audio depiction. This was all accomplished in WW3D and SAGE with the the Miles Sound System... which has been retired as of 2022 and is no longer offered nor downloadable from RAD Tools. This also means updating the Assimp3 code (misspelled as "Asimp3"). [Assimp] That's short for "Asset Importer," stop laughing. However, modern audio implementation may have better solutions to use for asset importing. Thus a replacement is necessary. So here are some great alternatives: MSS Alternatives List System Price External Links Wwise Depends on the license ($0-$40K) Wwise (Audiokinetic) FMOD FREE FMOD Steam Audio FREE Steam Audio Source Code (Valve) OpenAL FREE OpenAL OK, this needs a bit of explaining. Wwise and FMOD are the audio tools that you use to make your soundscapes, SFX, and everything audio that will go into your game (formatting and such). The MSS replacement. Steam Audio and OpenAL are the source code that implements that audio in real time for your game. WW3D and SAGE use Westwood Audio for implementing audio, but it will need to be adjusted to work with Wwise or FMOD and those source code libraries have the code to implement that change (handy!) Why Wwise? It's the best audio tool on the market used in all the biggest games. It has a variable license depending on the size of your project (which also means variable access to the program's capabilities). You can download the Wwise program free like the programs and source codes on the list, you will just have to apply for a license when it comes to making anything you intend to make money with. Otherwise (heh) it's free to use for small scale stuff. FMOD is still there if you need it. Oodle and Telemetry (the other tools you may or may not need) Oodle is a file size optimizer tool that helps you keep your game as small as possible. If you have ever seen the octopus Oodle logo on a game splash screen, that's what it's there for. There are alternatives like ZLIB (which SAGE uses, not a bad thing to add to WW3D), so you have options. Oodle costs $11,000 USD per game per platform. [Oodle Link] Telemetry is a tool that helps you optimize your game by showing you how it's performing in real time (you know, like showing you the Frames Per Second count). SAGE natively used BYTEmark for telemetry (we'll talk about this again later). There are others out there, including natively in-built telemetry tools in engines such as id Tech and Panda3D if you want to borrow other's tools via source code. And of course there are likely many others on the market to choose from. Telemetry costs $9,500 USD per game per platform. [Telemetry Link] As a reminder, both Oodle and Telemetry, as with any RAD Game Tool, are free to use so long as you are not charging anything for your game. NVidia functions (our first obsolete code!) [OBSOLETE] NVidia, when they got into the video game ecosystem, added new features that helped support the industry. Those tools and source code were distributed by NVidia for use by every company. They were so useful that they were integrated directly into Graphical APIs. Which means that the code that WW3D includes from NVidia is completely obsolete as it's handled natively by the DirectX API (and even OpenGL and Vulkan). It really shows WW3D's age and how long it took to develop Renegade. NvDXTLib (the oldest way to implement real time texture compression) [OBSOLETE for WW3D] Back before DXT compression was added natively to DirectX, this library in combination with NVidia's online tools were the only way to implement real-time texture compression. Since at least DirectX9, this is no longer needed. Just remove it from the WW3D code like SAGE did. Any modern API like DirectX11/12 and OpenGL/Vulkan have native texture compression built in, so you will never have to bother with this part of the source once you upgrade the graphical API. NVASM (HLSL the old fashioned way) [OBSOLETE for SAGE] Once again, back before the High-Level Shader Language became native, this was the only way to add the component to APIs like DirectX8.1. "But wait! SAGE is built on DirectX9!" I know, it's really weird to see this in SAGE given that API base. Perhaps it wasn't native to DX9 at the time, but it was definitely soon made obsolete by later versions of the code. So, yet again this is the case of a useful code base provided by NVidia that became a standard feature in modern graphical APIs like DirectX, OpenGL, and Vulkan. You can remove this code as soon as you update SAGE's graphical API. Lightscape and 3DSMax (3D asset importers, and what to do about them) All those who work with WW3D and SAGE know about the Westwood3D (.w3d) model format, but video game engines also include other asset formats to maximize the use of the modelling programs that they use to create 3D models in. For WW3D and SAGE, the other kind of assets include the Maya Binary (.mb) and 3DSMax (.MAX) model formats for static objects (though I cannot be certain if WW3D also had GMAX file compatibility, not that you would want it). Lightscape was an old software that Westwood used for making environments in Renegade with the lighting included. This was to import assets from programs like GMAX (the old game specific version of 3DS Max) without needing any conversion. SAGE replaced Lightscape with 3DSMax's asset importer. Later, SAGE 2 seems to have replaced 3DSMax with Maya (as shown with the behind the scenes for Tiberum Twilight). When it comes to source code involving 3DSMax and Maya, you will have to need to contact Autodesk directly to get that and possibly a license. Not much you can do about that. Unless, of course, you decide to use other model formats. You have a great variety of model formats to choose from: Filmbox Object (.fbx), Wavefront Object (.obj), LightWave Object (.lwo, Westwood made their 3D animated cutscenes in LightWave3D), COLLADA (.dae "digital asset exchange"), Extendable 3D (.X3D), Universal Scene Descriptor (.usd or .usdz), and gITF (.gLTF and .glb). So you have options outside of Autodesk's proprietary formats to use in your version of WW3D or SAGE (and you can just use as many as you want! The sky's the limit!) Many of these formats have their importer/exporter source code online. Do note that only some formats include animation data like .W3D, such as .lwo (hence why id Software's id Tech engine still use it alongside .md6), .X3D, .usd/.usdz, and .gLTF/.glb. Knowing that, it begins to make sense why companies made their own 3D formats to contain both 3D model data, animation data, and other properties like for particle emission. BYTEmark (aka NBench, the BYTE Magazine benchmark tool) OK, now we can talk about SAGE's telemetry. SAGE added BYTEmark (aka NBench) to the code for checking the performance of the game while it's operating. It's still very usable for WW3D and SAGE when it comes to testing your levels. You can get it here: [BYTEmark Link] [NBench Link and others]You can read more here: NBench (aka BYTEmark) BYTEmark has the following features: Numeric sort - Sorts an array of long integers. String sort - Sorts an array of strings of arbitrary length. Bitfield - Executes a variety of bit manipulation functions. Emulated floating-point - A small software floating-point package. Fourier coefficients - A numerical analysis routine for calculating series approximations of waveforms. Assignment algorithm - A well-known task allocation algorithm. Huffman compression - A well-known text and graphics compression algorithm. IDEA encryption - A relatively new block cipher algorithm. Neural Net - A small but functional back-propagation network simulator. LU Decomposition - A robust algorithm for solving linear equations. However, BYTEmark is outdated as a telemetry and has the following shortcomings: It cannot access the GPU (it was made when the CPU was still the common processor for graphics in the 1990s). These benchmarks are meant to expose the theoretical upper limit of the CPU, FPU, and memory architecture of a system It cannot measure video, disk (not like we're distributing on disks, more on that later), or network throughput (those are the domains of a different set of benchmarks) NBench (BYTEmark) is single-threaded. Currently, each benchmark test uses only a single execution thread. However, most modern operating systems have some multitasking component. How a system "scales" as more tasks are run simultaneously is an effect that NBench does not explore. So rather out of date with modern architecture So, if you seriously want to make a modern game on WW3D or SAGE, you will need a modern telemetry tool that can access modern hardware and networking. There are multiple available telemetry options available. The aforementioned Telemetry by RAD Tools, but there are also others out there that are specific to certain metrics (like networking) that can be used in tandem with BYTEmark. Maybe the community will create some kind of new solution out of existing telemetry code bases. This one is definitely a undertaking knowing how many WW3D and SAGE mods are multiplayer-centric. Might not hurt to ask what either Petroglyph or EA uses for their games. STLport (the multiplatform ANSI C++ Standard Library) [OUTDATED] STLport was a C++ library extension first introduced open source back in 1997. It's a library of standardized operations that work across multiple platforms, similar to Microsoft's STL library, but faster. There's a lot of useful tools in the library, such as those for networking. This was added to SAGE and likely was still used in SAGE 2. The version SAGE 1 used was STLport 4.5.3, but you'll want the most latest release of STLport which you can get here: [STLport 5.2.1] You can also get the older STLport that SAGE 1 used here [STLport 4.5.3] However, STLport is antiquated. Users started using alternatives since before 2014, and its last update was in 2019. Some users reported that it's not compatible with C++17 standards or above. That's not good when you're modernizing the source code. So this too will need to be replaced with a more modern implementation. Lucky for us there are many available to choose from. First up is Electronic Arts' very own EASTL library. The very same used in the Frostbite Engine: [EASTL source] No doubt if there ever was a SAGE 3 it would have used it, just like the Generals 2 project was using it (because it was using Frostbite). This library is up to date and maintained by EA, so that works for us. Another replacement option is the Boost library [Boost Library] which could be a possible consideration. Most users of STLport replaced it with CXX [CXX Tools] which might work as well. Lastly there is also the Qt library [Qt Base] which might also be considered. Umbra Occlusion Culling (how the camera renders what's in view) WW3D inherits SurRender3D's Umbra occlusion culling solution for the game camera's frustum in-view rendering. That means WW3D uses Umbra to render what's visible and not render what's not visible [Umbra Occlusion Culling Explanation]. Umbra is still used in the industry, but it's proprietary under Umbra (formerly Hybrid Graphics) and owned by Amazon. This means you would have to get in contact with Amazon if you want to use Umbra via a license. Umbra is still used as a middleware for modern implementation of occlusion culling (even id Software used it) so it's worth checking out if you can get a license. [DOOM2016 Graphics Study] SAGE is the evolution of WW3D, but it does not use Umbra, likely to avoid royalties, but also because new solutions were quickly coming about that were more useful for RTS games. That said, SAGE's occlusion culling is the obvious replacement for Umbra, but we shouldn't stop there. Newer occlusion culling solutions have appeared that supersede older methods due to superior rendering speed and efficiency. Doom 2016 uses the highly efficient Clustered Forward Rendering method that might be a perfect natural upgrade for WW3D and SAGE (using SAGE's code as the base). In the meantime, it might be just as useful to borrow id Tech's occlusion culling code for id Tech 4 as well [id Git for all open source id Tech][modernized Doom 3 BFG using Vulkan and DirectX12] Bonus: here's a solution someone made to combat wall hacking [Corner Culling anti-hack]. Might be useful for those who work with competitive multiplayer. GameSpy SDK (RIP GameSpy) [DEFUNCT] When GameSpy went down, it took all the multiplayer servers with it. C&C was heavily dependent on it for providing reliable multiplayer. As such it will have to be replaced in order for multiplayer to function. Luckily, GameSpy was used with so many games that there were multiple replacements made for it. You have options to consider: OpenSpy [OpenSpy client code] UniSpy [UniSpy SDK] Valve's Steam Networking SDK [Game Networking Sockets SDK] Finally, there's also working with the C&C Online team to fully integrate their C&C network hooking solution into the source code directly. [CNC Online] GNU Regex (open source regular expressions) [OUTDATED for WW3D] WW3D uses the GNU Regular Expressions library for its code. This particular library was likely used for the POSIX functions, which are now fully integrated with modern C libraries. Yet another thing that shows the age of WW3D. You can remove this code just like EALA did for SAGE's implementation. What's POSIX? Well it's more for UNIX/Linux compatibility [What is Posix?] SafeDisk API (Remember when you had to enter the CD Key?) [OBSOLETE] Both WW3D and SAGE used to use SafeDisk to prevent illegal copying. By Windows 7, this API was on its way out needing backwards compatibility and by Windows 10 it is no longer compatible. Honestly, with the rise of online game clients like Steam and GOG (and C&C fan sites), are we really selling computer games on disks anymore? You can completely remove all the code related to the SafeDisk API in WW3D and SAGE without ever looking back. It's no longer needed. That aside, the API was proprietary and now it's no longer offered. Microsoft Cab Archive (for compressing data) [OUTDATED for WW3D] WW3D used the MS Cabinet Archive Library to compress files into the .CAB format. It's a bit different from zip files in compression method, but in the end it's for the same reason. You can find some code online for .CAB extractors, but SAGE replaced this with the ZLIB library to use zip files instead. So that's probably the best option as well. ZLIB (Zip files for gaming) [The SAGE Solution] SAGE uses the ZLIB library [ZLIB 1.3.1] and it's code for using it should be copied into WW3D. It's a logical upgrade. That aside, if you wish for superior file compression, Oodle from the RAD Game Tools is also available at different levels of compression. Though zip files should serve you decent until you start making your game rather large. LZH-Light Compression (additional compression option) [OUTDATED for SAGE] SAGE also includes the LZH-Light compression library [LZH-Light Code]. It's an old one and needs to be replaced because there are no recent releases for it and thus it's not compatible with modern C++ standards. [What is LZH-Light?] It's part of a family of LHA (originally "LHarc") archiving programs made by Haruyasu "Yoshi" Yoshizaki. Luckily LHA is still around, even if Oodle has replaced most compression methods for games, and you can get source code for it here: [LHAsa source] There are other versions out there as well for various OSes since the 90s, so there's an interesting assortment to dig around to find alternatives [LHA Wiki with further links] RTPatch Library (for updating the game via Patches) WW3D uses the RTPatch library for patching the game code. This is a proprietary library that was used by practically all the major companies back in the day. You might be able to get a modern implementation of it from Pocket Soft [Pocket Soft Contact]. Though it would appear that SAGE replaced it (as did many companies with their later engines), so it's a good bet that you could probably just use what SAGE uses. Or any modern patch solution really. The source code only exists to decode the RTP patch format. There is a modern patching solution that EA uses called Known Version Patching (KVP) [KVP] that makes use of Amazon services to do the patching [The Amazon Component]. I'm not sure if EA does licensing for it, but it wouldn't hurt to ask. Then there is the custom patching route. You can pay for a lifetime license to use a customizable game patcher for either WW3D or SAGE [Game Patch Creator] It's worth consideration. Java Runtime Headers (for online servers in WW3D) This is one is the easiest to do. Just grab the most recent Java Runtime Header library and add it in [Oracle Java Downloads] However, this is an old way of handling online. SAGE replaced this fully with its version of the GameSpy implementation, and with WW3D also having GameSpy probably means that the Java code was a transitional backup. All the same, it doesn't have to be removed, and can simply be there as backup still. Math and Physics Updates (Modernization Options for WW3D and SAGE) It's not necessary to update the Westwood Math and Westwood Physics libraries in order to compile your code, however, it is a major upgrade to get more out of the engine. You cannot use image compression like BINK2 without scalable vector graphics, which requires the SSE math function at version 2 or higher. [Image Processing Libraries that contain SSE4.2] <-(might be necessary if the below math libraries do not include SSE4.2) When EALA transitioned from SAGE 1 to SAGE 2 with Red Alert 3, they didn't just change the graphical API from DX9 to DX10, they also replaced the Westwood Math and Physics libraries with RenderWare's Math and Physics libraries. Unfortunately, Criterion's RenderWare Engine is still proprietary with currently no way to license it despite EA removing engine restrictions for their devs. So that means we need alternatives to either splice into the Westwood libraries, or to replace them. There are many options to choose from for C++ math libraries, so it's not that hard to find one that works. Here's a few: DirectX's XNA Math Library [XNA programming guide], OpenGL Math (Not just for OpenGL) [GL Math], Sony's Vector Math Library [Sony Vector Math], and Eigen (the math library that Panda3D uses) [Eigen Main Site]. As for physics, there are multiple solutions: Havok (up to date as of 2025, well done Havok team) [Havok Physics], Bullet [Bullet Physics 3.0], ODE [ODE Physics (old and used to fill gaps in Bullet)], and Jolt (doesn't have impulse, but has everything else) [Jolt Physics]. (Personally, I support using Jolt, it's open source so no royalties for great quality) The Final Hurdle for either WW3D or SAGE As described in the Renegade and Generals source codes (compiling section), you will have to update the .dsw file (old Visual Studio file) to the modern Visual Studio format. This will be a pain in the butt, however it is necessary. I wish the best to whoever has to do that process, because it will be slow. Anyway, thank you for reading this. I hope this ends up being useful to someone.

Upload any C&C related memes here, I'm bored.

It looks like EA just dumped the entirety of the franchise on Steam as is, with some very minor patching to run on modern systems. https://store.steampowered.com/app/1213210/Command__Conquer_Remastered_Collection/ On one hand, I'm eager to see all the new players coming into the C&C community. There'll be plenty of discussion to be had (and newbs to pwn in multiplayer!), which will be nice. Hopefully the servers won't explode with all the additional installs over the next couple of months. However, one thing that worries me is the possibility of total young'un takeover. I understand that not everyone under the age of 20 is some braindead 'Skibidi Toilet' obsessed Tik Tokker, but the last thing we need is people spamming the forms and ingame chats with "Yo, where's the battle pass and V-bucks? No cap, sheesh!" or "Wow, Nod is using chemical weapons? That's so not bussin, not on fleek, I'm going to complain to EA on Twitter". How do you guys feel about the popularity? And am I just bitter and paranoid, or do you think we might actually get flooded & taken over by the Tik Tok generation?

I remember old discussions years back about when RA1 took place and recently I found a transcript archive of a Q&A that took place in 06 Feb 1996 which was really early in RA1's development and had some interesting information. Well It may not be much but I always wanted a specified date of the war unless I missed some information somewhere. XD VENOM: what's the story behind RA and in what time and technology level will it be on ? WSAdam: Okay -- Here's the scoop: World War II never happened the way that we think of it. Hitler never came to power, and there was no WWII... for a while. We're spinning European history in a new direction, with Joseph Stalin and the USSR coming to power as the big heavy in the game. The player can play the Allies or the USSR as they strive for conquest of Europe. The technology ranges from 1940's to 1980's, but that doesn't mean that you're going to be commanding Pintos! We've also spun the technology up a bit, so there's plenty of cool stuff for you to use.. like attack dogs! Rambo: what will RA's story line be about? WSAdam: RA is an alternate time line that takes place in the 70's. WWII in Europe happened in another way, where Stalin and the USSR became the big heavy that threatened Europe. Also some neat early ideas at the time kane: how will you earn your money to make units? Tiberium? WSAdam: Ahh- this is somethingwe changed. Since Tiberium isn't around yet, the player has ore to mine (on the board, not in mines) to get money -- there are three types of ore, so which one you go after will determine how much money you get per load. Sure, you can go after the copper, but that Iron deposit is worth more, but closer to the opponent - - it adds a strategic advantage to what you collect. WSAdam: there are three ores, Copper, Nickel, and Iron. Each is worth a different amount of $$ per scoop for your ore collector. We've kept the metaphor of harvesting, but now you've got a dump-truck like unit with a scooper, and an Ore Processor. WSAdam: Side note -- we considered power lines, but they were problematic for the computer and made the game a lot more of a sim than we want it to be. They were found here: http://www.tibcom.com/wchat/transcripts/

Good Evening everyone. I have a legit question I've been thinking about recently. More often then not, there seems to not be a lot of RTS Games coming out or at least any of particular interest to me. It could possibly be that I have not been looking or paying to much attention but I've also been stuck on the old school ones as well. In my theory, RTS games have come down to Twitch/Competitive Gaming type games which means the quality has been drastically decreased to the point of the story being non-existent, horrid or irrelevant. I also believe that It can be agreed that 1995-2006 was a really good golden decade for RTS games in general. With this said I want to know which RTS game is the best, examining not just the game but a lot of other things such as What makes a great RTS game? Total Annihilation Company of Hero's Starcraft I have never played this and I’m sorry. It is good and popular enough that I’ve put it on this list. I am sure someone can vouch for it Command and Conquer (Any game) Star Wars Empire at War (w/ expansions included) I understand obviously there may be other titles that I may have missed out but these are what I found to be the best and that I have played so far. If your choice is not listed on here then feel free to comment your favorite RTS game and what makes it so special!

So i want to make game scifi WW2 or dieselpunk stuff, but because i'm still newbie on programing and 3d modeling might be really need help from professional modders in here, any of you would like the idea? (I made this picture using photoshop)

Hey guys! I was just wondering if someone could tell me the story of Darth Plaguis the Wise the old APB vs Reborn feud? I was rereading forum posts from 2015 (Ahhh memories) and came across people comparing that drama to the old APB vs Reborn. Can someone fill me in on when this happened and what happened? I assume it was from the mid 2000's.

Everytime a new W3D Game got announced, my excitement goes up to eleven. Especially the announcement of Ground Zero gave me hope seeing another classic C&C Game adapted into a 3D FPS Game (Renegade was a bit too futuristic to count as a convertion of Tiberian Dawn into an FPS Game). Over the years we saw different approaches of newer C&C Games adapted into the Renegade Style like Scud Storm for Generals or Tiberium Wars Mods like The Third Tiberium War or Tiberium Crystal Wars. We even saw a C&C 4 Map popping up over the years. But none of the mentioned Mods got far in development or had several design problems. After learning more about the Design of Renegade and several other W3D Mods i thought about concepts how to bring EA-Era C&C Titles like Generals, Tiberium Wars or Red Alert 3 into the First Person Perspective. Despite being a controversial or obscure title i wouldn't even cut out Total Convertions for Tiberian Twilight or Rivals. This is not a thread to ask if somebody will create Mod XYZ, more like my ideas for potential mods and whats your idea or opinion on them. I just starting 3D Modeling and a bit animation and far from it to be good to create my own W3D Game (but i still want to improve my skills!). And please don't judge me on my bad english skills! Design of the Bases: First of all - there should be no Base Building in these Mods. The Concept for Base Building in Renegade isn't bad, Scud Storm and other Renegade Mods show'd it's possible but its a big impact on the Map Design and depends on your team players. Many Maps would have to be flat for putting each building on the map and some players could mess up the base layout. Also it would be a pacing breaker if the team first has to build a base before they can start into combat. The only deployable buildings should be atleast bunkers or smaller defenses like in Interm Apex. As example Tiberium Wars GDI Infantry and RA3 Soviet Engineers would have the ability to deploy bunkers. Factions, Sub-Factions and different Generals: One of the problem of later C&C Games since RA2 Yuris Revenge (or we also could argue the problem exists since the Dune RTS Games) the existence of more than 2 factions in the games. Renegade atm only supports 2 factions per match so the only solution atm is to made it depending on the Map Setting (also a 3-4 Faction Map would be really hard to handle and it would be hard to get so much players on it because the engine got frame drops if 40-50 people are ingame). In the Generals Universe the USA and China fought together against the GLA so this is a lesser problem. In terms of Tiberium Wars, i would also throw the mutants from tiberium alliances into the mix because they had a solid foundation of units and buildings in the game. So this would be the constellation= Generals: USA vs GLA/ China vs GLA (USA vs China maybe only on a fun map or competitive map?) Tiberium Wars: GDI vs Nod (no brainer), GDI vs Scrin, Nod vs Scrin, GDI vs Mutants, Nod vs Mutans (because of the setting from Alliances) Red Alert 3: Allies vs Soviets (no brainer), Allies vs Empire, Soviets vs Empire For the Sub-Factions and different Generals i would handle it like this - throwing the exclusive units and other stuff into their main factions. This would solve the Infantry Problem in a Generals Mod, because Generals didn't had much infantry classes for just one side and so you don't necessary need to create new original classes. As example China would have basically 4 base units, adding the other generals exclusive ones in, they would get the Minigunner, Super Hacker and Super Lotus. Same for GLA, they would get Toxin and Stealth Units from the respective Generals. Also it should apply for Tiberium Wars and their respective sub factions from Kanes Wrath. Handling of the Support Powers, Upgrades and Team Promotions: Here starts to differentiate each game really heavily. But all games also would have something in common. They would have the advantage that upgrade systems already exists in mods like Interm Apex. In Generals all upgrades have to be researched by different buildings. Depending on the map which tech level and buildings are available it would be possible to limit the upgrade mania of generals. But basically all support powers are unlocked by general's promotions. The System should look like these = depending on the team score and performance, the team will get promotion points like in generals. So players can unlock the support powers and other upgrades via the purchase terminal and can also use them with it. Tiberium Wars is a whole different beast. There was no Promotion System for the player, all upgrades and powers are bound to their respective buildings. So it would be much more important to save certain buildings or the team will loose access to their unexplored upgrades and support powers. Also mappers could limit the upgrades and support powers, depending which buildings they put on the map. Red Alert 3 is again is complete own thing. Instead of relying on upgrades for units in different buildings, it only has a promotion system, similar to Generals. Of course we also have to talk about the super weapons of each game. Scud Storm, Nuke Missles, Ion Cannon, Rift Generator, Proton Collider, Vacuum Bomb, and the Psionic Wave would function as normal, just a beacon like weapon for mass destruction (1-MainBuilding Destroyer and damages main buildings nearby, destroying smaller weaker nearby buildings too) But we have also some specialized super weapons. The Particle Cannon also should work with a beacon but with a twist. If a player launched a Particle Cannon successful its also a 1-Main Building Destroyer. But if a second player stands on a purchase terminal at the own base, he can additional control it! So the Particle Cannon would be still strong for one player but encourages to handle it by another team member to maximize his destructive potential. The Renegade Mod Scud Storm solved the Super Weapon Problem with moving icons but the enemy team wouldn't had any chance to disarm/counter primary Super Weapons with that method. Same goes for Chronosphere, Iron Curtain and Nanoswarm Barrier. They would need some team member at a terminal to activate. Focus of each game: IMO a generals mod should have the arcarde infantry combat of APB and TSR, but should more focus on vehicle combat. Generals was a tank-dominated game so it would fit pretty well. Tiberium Wars would be more like balanced between infantry and vehicle combat, like APB and TSR. Also there would be a much bigger option for air combat because of 3 factions with air units. RA3 would open a new window for naval combat, because you could also have bases on the sea. Extra Stuff: - All Games should have the Unit Promotion System like in TSR or in AR. - For a Tiberium Wars Coop Defense Map it could be use a layout from the Tiberium Wars Mobile Game. So we also had a reference to that Game too. - To build on a solid foundation for these mods, i would use existing mods as a base. RA A Path Beyond would be perfect for a Generals Mod, Pipline is the perfect testing ground for GLA Units. Tiberium Wars should be use TSR 2.0 as a base and a Red Alert 3 Mod Apocalypse Rising because RA 2 and 3 are similar in certain mechanics. - A Red Alert 3 Mod could be got some sort of Prototype in Form of a RA Mobile Mod. IMO the part between YR and the Prologe Cutscene of RA3 is not well known and only the iOS Game covers it. Many units are function quite the same like their ra2 and 3 versions. - Why i am throwing Tiberium Alliances into the mix of Tiberium Wars and Kanes Wrath? Because 90% of the units and buildings are the same and have additional buildings that could be used greatly like MG Nests, Barbed Wire, Anti Tank Barrier and more. - Yes we should have epic units in a Tiberium Wars and RA3 Mod. I would like to drive a MARV, Reedemer, Hexapod, Shogun Executioner and a Giga Fortress. But they would need big maps to perform well. But we have the Mammoth MK2 in TSR so... - For a RA3 Mod the Ore Field and economy system would be a bit different. Each Side would have a refinery with a single Ore Mine in base and a AI Miner would drive/swim back to back. To give players the possibility to get additional ore they could go out and get ore from other ore mines. But it would mean we need additional Ore Refineries in the base. So maybe the outpost units could be reworked into sort-of smol refinery versions. Also they would have a purpose in the renegade gameplay. - To create the models, imo i would use the models from the respective games first and would use them as place holder. As a 3D Artist i would then improve on these models until they are different enough not be a copyright problem. The biggest problem would be to create animations for the Scrin and the Empire. Scrin Units are mostly organic and Empire Vehicles have alot of transformation animations. And for the last part many people will hate me. But i would also like to see Renegade Mods for Tiberian Twilight and Rivals. There was a C&C 4 Map for Renegade created and sort of worked. A full mod like these would create a "Capture the flag" Gamemode, but base mode would also possible. Each Crawler would function as a Production Building and there are also certain types of base defenses in Tib. Twilight. And instead of getting tiberium for credits players would collect tiberium crystals for upgrades and crates for upgrading their units. Rivals on the other hand would be more like a quick match-type of game with smaller maps. All in all nearly all of these ideas for future W3D Games for C&C Games are possible with all their mechanics. Sadly certain games couldn't get converted to the W3D Engine because of copyright reasons. Imagine LotR Battle for Middle Earth 1+2 in Renegade, Generals 2 for obvious canceled reasons, Star Wars Empire at War etc. I even had an idea for a Metroid Version of Renegade but Nintendo would DMCA that immediately.

Hello everyone! We've recently been having discussions among the staff about balance. With the recent high amount of game nights, it’s brought a lot of attention to certain units and maps. We’d like to ask our community to participate in giving feedback on anything you feel is off or not performing how you believe it should. This can range from damage not being high enough with a certain unit, to even prices being too high/low. Do you think a certain map has a higher advantage for one team over another? Now is the time to speak up! Let’s get to discussing

http://www.moddb.com/mods/cc-assault http://en.ccassault.com Commando Assault is a mod which was first released in 2010 for C&C Renegade. And it allows to build up base from scratch on Westwood 3D game engine. Inspired by Battlezone series of videogames. Has its separate music (including Frank Klepacki's works that he exclusively approved for this mod, some of my remakes of his famous songs and even my new melodies) and unique features. Want to speed up construction rate to reduce time you are waiting for new purchase that you made? To capture existing building or steal it while it is not deployed yet (or even MCV)? To drop player-controlled tanks in the rear of enemy base? To win with one useless structure? You have all in one. Welcome back again, commander, crush your enemies with your own 3D-hands and lead your forces to fight. More tactics, more fun, more teamplay. Some videos are under spoiler: Feel free to discuss and share this stuff =)

I’d like to use this topic to get some general feedback from the community. If these buildings were to appear in the game at some point, what would you want them to do? What would their purpose serve to gameplay? Let’s get those gears turning!

Ok, Here's The Run-Down, I'm Trying To Play RA3 With Mods, I've Made A New Profile, Deleted The Skirmish.ini File, But The Mods Won't Work (Except Shock Therapy) The Custom Menu Screens Won't Show Up, Mods Like Epic War Just Crash My Game When I Try To Start A Skirmish Match, And Some Like Paradox That Let You Start A Match, But The AI Won't Do A Thing! What's Happening?! How Can I Fix This?! (Basically, I'm Not Getting These Menues In The Picture Provided, And Mods Are Crashing)

Hello players! We’d first like to thank everyone for joining another amazing game night! We once again want to ask that you reply with a nomination for which players they felt were the real MVPs of the night. After 24 hours from now, we’ll tally up the names and announce the MVP and Runner Up awards! What’re you waiting for? Get to voting!

APOCALYPSE RISING MAFIA II DARK NIGHT Following the Allies' surrender in the previous iteration, the Soviets have grown more confident and are preparing to mount a nuclear assault. The Allies have responded by infiltrating the missile base, but only have a limited amount of time to disable the silos and destroy the base. Rules are similar to the previous game, and you may read up on @VERTi60's APB V game with similar mechanics: The Soviets (Town) faction will win by eliminating all hostile factions, or if the nuclear missiles can launch (timed victory). The countdown will vary based on how many players sign up for the game. The timer will be announced at game start and each day phase. The Allies (Mafia) faction will win by controlling the day phase votes. If there is a Third Party faction, their win condition is classified. The following is the rolesheet for this game. You will notice some adjustments have been made since the previous iteration. The rolesheet is subject to change based on number of players and further balancing. Obviously, not every role will make an appearance and not every role will have its maximum quantity. Data on a possible third party role is unavailable. ROLE MAX QUANTITY DAY ACTION NIGHT ACTION Conscript 5 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (25% stuck chance, 25% kill chance). One time use. ##PRACTICE - Attend target practice and decrease your stuck chance by 25% for the following day. Hostiles will know if you practiced. One time use. Tesla Trooper 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (50% stuck chance, 75% kill chance). One time use. ##SURGE <player> - Fire an electrical shot at your target and roleblock them. Engineer 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (25% stuck chance, 25% kill chance). One time use. ##REPAIR <target> - Attempt to fix a Missile Silo. Will block infiltrations if they occur at the same time. Rhino Tank 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (0% stuck chance, 75% kill chance). One time use. ##PROTECT <player> - Serve as protection for your target. If they are targeted for nightkill, you will die instead. Radar Tower 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (100% stuck chance, 0% kill chance). One time use. ##PING <player> - Ping a player and learn their role. Missile Silo 2 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (100% stuck chance, 0% kill chance). One time use. NUCLEAR MISSILE (passive) - If the Silo remains operational on a certain day, Soviets win. If all Silos are destroyed, Soviets lose. If all Silos are infiltrated, timed victory condition is nullified. Sniper 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (50% stuck chance, 75% kill chance on infantry, 0% kill chance on vehicles/buildings). One time use. ##SCOUT <player> - Scout a player and learn their role. Spy 2 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (25% stuck chance, 25% kill chance). One time use. ##INFILTRATE <player> - Attempt to infiltrate your target. If it's a Silo, they are disabled. If it's a Radar Tower, their report will be scrambled. Mirage Tank 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (0% stuck chance, 75% kill chance). One time use. DISGUISE (passive) - Night actions used on you always fail (target appears blocked). Disguise is lost if you shoot. Tanya 1 ##SHOOT <target> - Attempt to shoot and kill your target (25% stuck chance, 75% kill chance). One time use. ##KISS IT BYE BYE <target> - Perform an unstoppable kill on your target. One time use. I'm aiming to start the game on February 19th. Signups will close 24-48 hours before then. Signed Players (minimum 10) @Killing_You @Shade939 @OrangeP47 @ChopBam @Coolrock @Category 5 Hurricane @Anon_Kat @Retaliation @FRAYDO @Mojoman @Louis

Hello players! We’d first like to thank everyone for joining another amazing game night! We’d like everyone to reply with a nomination for which players they felt were the real MVPs of the night. After 24 hours from now, we’ll tally up the names and announce the MVP and Runner Up awards! What’re you waiting for? Get to voting!

I noticed that Soviets had dogs in RA1 and then later both Soviets and Allies had dogs in RA2 Strangely after the tiberian meteor hits and tiberian dawn rolls around no dogs. Later in tiberian sun this creature emerges the tiberian fiend. I think it is possible that the large numbers of dogs became mutants? This is Lore not cannon, but I think it answers the question

So, the last few days i've been trying to be more active in-game and in the W3D community (Discord, Forum) and, (maybe i'm wrong, please tell me if i am) i've noticed that, even though we have this many people interested in these games, and we have so many discussing about them, the actual playerbase is quite small. Usually, when i go and play some, i open the launcher and i see this The mods, that i'm the most interested in, and love, have 0 players, almost constantly. Maybe i'm just checking at the wrong time, and there is a playerbase to these games and i just don't notice it, hopefully. If someone can tell me why, please do, i'm really desperate to play them with the community. and i would love to hear opinions and explanations. (Also, excuse me for the formatting, etc. of my post, i'm a first timer forum user. :D )

Another topic we’d like to hear the community on. I’m sure there’s at least a few people who would love to see Attack Dogs get added to the game. The biggest issue I always hear is are Spies powerful enough to warrant adding them into the game? I’d like to see some brainstorming on this topic. What could make the Spy better to allow the team to add the Attack Dog?

Thank you all for an amazing Game Night event. To determine our MVP prizes, we will be using player votes for this. Cast your vote here and we will tally up at the end of the day (10 PM CST/3 AM UTC).

First off is my attempt at a Nod badged Blackbird: There are extensive topology issues, and I am not really happy with it at all. Next is my take on the C&C Rivals Drone Swarm: No Rotors yet! Here is an in game screen using EALA's Repair APC as a drone controller!: It is a bit of a nothing model, but it was interesting to complete.

So here is one familiar to APB fans, the Demo truck! I have since made the tires lighter Overall I am disappointed with how this turned out, it looks like a toy (even allowing for low quality RTS assets). I only wanted a Soviet badged version, but it is obviously trivial to have an Allied or neutral version if desired at a later date. The actual nuke warhead is an EALA asset from C&C 3.

So we're all having fun in a 6v6, not that many but any players are good since the server's been pretty empty lately, then the map changed and this moron voted to skip it cause 'he didn't like the map' then he left either way, killing the server. It went from 12 players to 5 just like that(it was 5 Nod vs 1 GDI when I left because there was no point tbh). I wouldn't mind the map change if we had a higher amount of players and could afford to lose a few if others joined later on. You got more chances of people joining with higher amounts of players than with 5 since there isn't much going on and people try to cheese a win as fast as they can. Now I'm sitting here bored as hell in a saturday night with nothing to play

This is a RA 2 styled Oil Derrick that I modelled and textured. Once it came time for the animations, I messed up (probably should have come here first), so the animation is off. At some future date I will redo the model rig, and have another try. There are some bland sections, but for an RTS, I feel it will do.

I'M BAAACK!! I was rather pleased with this model, because I do not often get a good result when I model structures. If the proportions seem off, this is because they were adjusted so that the vehicle models that I had at the time could physically exit the factory, whilst also ensuring that the amount of space required to place the structure in a base was not too prohibitive.

Welp. Its here. And where ever you are, its probably there too. Lets talk about it - calmly. I am from the United States, currently living in the Nashville Tennessee area, and we have a couple of confirmed cases here (not surprising when there are over a million people). People are panic-buying items like toilet paper (???) soap/disinfectants, cleaning supplies, bread, eggs, meat, etc... While filling up my truck with gasoline earlier (yes I was actually empty, 0.5 gallons remaining), I noticed an older gentleman next to me filling up small Diesel and Gasoline cans in the back of his truck. In the supermarket (walmart in this case), the grocery section was a little on the wild side, very crowded, with most people trying to look like they aren't panic-buying, and shaking their heads in disapproval at the empty shelves which would normally hold things that you wouldn't expect to be sold-out in a "crisis". We currently have some traveling restrictions in effect for going/coming into/out of the country, but nothing internal, yet. There is a rumor that some sort of, dare I say it, self-"quarantine" protocol (basically a strong suggestion to stay at home unless absolutely necessary) might be put into effect "soon". Most people here are handling it quite well I believe. Others, well...yeah others have lost their minds, but I've not seen too many of those yet. What about there? Where are you? What are your federal and local governments doing in response? How about your citizens? Keep this thread civil and panic-free please. Panic helps nobody. And if you don't know the facts, then don't speculate. There is no need to spread misinformation.